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members of the committee, since we have had so much argument on the bill and have had so much information, that we should now take up the bill and have the suggested amendments pointed out, and short arguments on each one of those; not, however, with any idea of coming to a conclusion on the question at this time, but simply with the idea of getting the purport of the amendments, and then after the bill has been amended, my thought would be to have each one of the attorneys and the assistant commissioner make a statement with regard to the whole measure as to how it will operate over the whole situation. Now, if there is any objection to that suggestion and that method of So, let us hear that first. ... ELSTON. Mr. Chairman, I suggest, too, that without any introduction of matter or argument that we get right down to the points at issue so we can make it as brief and definite as possible. The CHAIRMAN. That is exactly what I had in mind, and have the amendments pointed out and simply briefly discuss it, and see if we can go through it just the same as we did the Crow bill the other day. Then, after we have gotten all the amendments in, if some one wants to make a statement with regard to the whole measure, which, of course, has got to be concise and to the point, because we have got a big record on this thing, if the committee has no objections, we would hear that. Mr. BALLINGER. Mr. Chairman, you limited the attendance to-day to the attorneys. Mr. Rogers is a member of the general council, is an attorney, and is here. Could he not be permitted to be present The CHAIRMAN. Certainly; anyone who can give us any light on the question, if we want it, but we do not want any argument from anybody to-day except those who are here for the purpose. Mr. HENDERSON. Mr. Chairman, in that connection I would like to say that I have been so recently employed in this matter and we have here representing the Red Lake Indians just one delegate who is so well informed, and I think will be of as much service as any man. The CHAIRMAN. He can be of service to you, but we are not going to listen to any extraneous proposition. We want the advice of the attorney now and the counselor at law, so that if we get any information it is not going to be a lengthy discussion of something that has already been up. Mr. BALLINGER. Mr. Chairman, as the general council is offering amendments shall I proceed 2 The CHAIRMAN. Well, I think that would be in order. My idea is that you and the commissioner here are the main parties to be heard, and | think it would be wise for Mr. Ballinger to present his amendo and make his statement, and then let Mr. Meritt answer for the rest. Mr. KELLY. I think that is the proper idea. Mr. BALLINGER. Mr. Commissioner, merely a suggestion, so that the record may be complete, if you will permit me to insert—I have in typewriting the amendments desired, and if you will permit them to be inserted in the record at this point, then I will take them up in their order. The CHAIRMAN. Why not put them in one at a time as we go along with the bill?

Mr. Elston. We had better put them in first so that we can read them all together.

The CHAIRMAN. All right; we will do that. (The paper referred to follows:)

AMENDMENTS PROPOSED BY THE GENERAL COUNCIL TO THE COMMITTEE PRINT OF

DEPARTMENTAL DRAFT ADMINISTRATIVE BILL.

viz: i

Page 1. Strike out the title and insert in lieu thereof the following: “To wind up the affairs of the Chippewa Indians of Minnesota." Line 5, after the words "and one by the”, insert the words "executive committee", and in line 6, reinstate the first two words, viz: "of the".

Page 2. Lines 19, 20, and 21, reinstate the words stricken out. Lines 23, 24, and 25, reinstate the matter stricken out, with the following changes: Line 23, after the word "enrolled”, insert the words “and allotted”. Line 23, after the word "shall", insert the word “also”. Line 24, strike out the word “ residing” and insert in lieu thereof the word "belonging". Line 25, after the word "and", and before the word - allotted”, insert the word "not".

Page 4. Line 15, after the word " incompetent”, insert the word “allotted”. Lines 20, 21, and 22, strike out the following words “ except the Chippewas residing on and belonging to the Red Lake Reservation”.

Page 5. Commencing with the word "that”, in line 8, reinstate the matter stricken out in lines 8, 9, and 10.

Page 6. Line 6, reinstate the word “forthwith”.

Page 10. Line 9, reinstate the words "thgether with the accrued interest”. Line 10, change the word “minor” to “adult”. Lines 11 and 12, strike out the words in italics, viz: upon his attaining his or her majority". Line 14, strike out the word “of”. Line 22, reinstate the word "shall". Line 23, strike out the word in italics,

may” Page 11. Line 2, after the word "child”, insert “either of”. Line 2, strike out the words “parent or”. Line 19, after the word "all”, insert "merchantable”. Commencing with the word “which”, in line 21, strike out the remainder of that line and all of lines 22, 23, and down to and including the figures " 400”, in line 24. Line 25, reinstate the matter stricken out.

Page 12. Commencing with the word "except”, in line 1, strike out the remainder of that line, all of line 2, and down to and including the work reserve”, in line 3, Line 6, strike out the words "said amendatory”, and insert in lieu thereof the word “the”. Line 7, after the figures “1902” and before the colon, insert “(32 Statutes at Large, page 400)”. Line 17, reinstate the words stricken out, viz: "and undisposed of” Lines 17 and 18, strike out the words in italics, viz: “and not included in any reserve and not disposed of”. Line 23, strike out the word “designated”, and insert the word “appointed":

Page 12. Line 24, after the word "the" and before the words “general council,'' insert "the executive committee of the.” Line 25, strike out the words and appointed by the Secretary of the Interior."

Page 13. Line 2, after the word "land" insert the words "including any timber thereon."

Page 14. At the end of line 8, insert the following: Provided, That the Secretary of the Interior may dispose of so much of Cooper or Star Island in Cass Lake and so much of the land bordering on the eastern, southeastern, and southern shores of (ass Lake, and commonly known as Norway Beach, and the lands adjoining the western shores of Pine Point on Leech Lake and the standing timber thereon as remains .undisposed of, in tracts of limited areas for permanent or summer homes, hotels, or resorts under regulations to be prescribed by the said Secretary and approved by the executive committee of the Chippewa General Council.” Line 15, after the word “fund” change the semicolon to a comma and reinstate the matter stricken out in lines 15, 16, 17, 18, and 19.

Page 15. Line 1, after the word “upon” insert the following: “and with the approval of the executive committee of the general council.” Line 2, reinstate the words stricken out, viz: “or all” and after the word "all” insert the words “school equipment." Line 3, before the word “and” insert the words "used for school purposes.” Line 4, after the word "Indians” insert the following: “Any school property not turned over to the State and remaining undisposed of shall be sold nder the direction of the Secretary of the Interior for the best price obtainable.”

Page 16. Line 15, strike out the words in italics and reinstate the words stricken out in lines 15 and 16. Line 17, strike o'it the words in italic and reinstate the word stricken out. Line 17, after the word "and" insert "in his discretion other.”

Page 17. Line 9, before the words "general council" insert the words "executive committee of the.”

Page 18. Line 24, after the words “public school" insert the words and park.”

Page 19. Reinstate section 5, with the following amendments: Line 8, strike out the word "at.”! Line 9, strike out the words “Bemidji, Minnesota.” Line 9, after the word “beginning” strike ort the word and figure "July 8.”. Line 9, after the word“ beginning” insert the following: “on the second Tuesday in July of” so that it will read as amended: “to be held annually, beginning on the second Tuesday in July of each year, pursuant to the constitution of the general council.” Line 17, strike out the word "such” and insert in lieu thereof the word “so."

Page 20. Reinstate lines 1 and 2.
Pages 26, 27, and 28. Change section 5 to section 6.

Page 28. Change section 6 to section 7. Include section 8. Strike ont lines 11, 12, 13, and 14. Include section 9. Lines 20, 21, 22, 23, and 24, reinstate the matter stricken out. Lines 24 and 25, strike out the words in italic.

Page 29. Strike out the words in italic in lines 1, 2, and 3 down to and including the word "expenses.” Add U. R. 12972 as additional sections, renumbering sections.

Page 1. Renumber section 1 as section 10.

Page 2. (hange section 2 to section 11. Line 19, after the word “thereof” insert the following: "and lawfully chargeable against said tribe or any band thereof."' Line 22, after the word "amendment” insert the words “at any time during the progress of the suit.”

Page 3. Line 11, strike out the words “for the purpose of making” and insert in lieu thereof the words and shall furnish such certified.” Line 11, after the word “thereof” insert the words “free of cost.” Renumber section 3 as section 12.

Page 4. Renumber section 4 as section 13. Lines 8 and 9, strike out the words "under contract or contracts made and approved as provided by existing law" and insert in lieu thereof the words “by their general council.” Renumber section 5 as section 14. In line 22, strike out the word “or” and insert the word “and: Line 23, after the word “Chippewas” insert “which shall include all the Chippewa Indians residing on and belonging to said reservation.”

Page 5. Line 5, after the word “Band" insert the following: "The court shall also determine the ownership of any funds that may hereafter be derived from the sale and disposition of any of the property on the Red Lake Reservation, and all funds now in hand and that may hereafter accrue from the disposition of any such property on the Red Lake Reservation shall be held subject to the final determination of the case and shall then be disbursed in strict conformity with the decree of said court." Line 13, after the word "States” strike out the word “or” and insert "and.” Line 20, strike out the words “for the purpose of making” and insert in lieu thereof the words “and shall furnish such.” Line 21, after the word "thereof” insert the words “free of cost."

Page 6. Line 8, after the word "made" insert the words "if the Indians residing on and belonging to the Red Lake Reservation are successful.” Line 10, strike out the period after the word "suit” and insert a comma and add the following: “and if said Red Lake Indians are unsuccessful said $5,000 and expenses shall be paid out of the Public Treasury to be reimbursed out of any funds to which the individual member of said band may be entitled before any further payments out of the tribal property shall be made to any of the members of said bands; Line 17, after the word "the" insert the following: “General Council of the Chippewa Indians of Minnesota to represent the.” Lines 17 and 18, strike out the words under contract or contracts made and approved as provided by existing law.”. Renumber section 6 as section 15.

Page 7. Line 5, after the parenthesis following the figures “642" insert the following: or to which the Indian title had not been lawfully extinguished by cession.” Line 5, strike out the word “subsequently.” Lines 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, and 23, strike out the words “under rules and regulations to be prescribed by the Secretary of the Interior; and the proceeds derived from the sale of such lands shall similarly be deposited in the Treasury of the United States in the principal fund of said Chippewa Indians” and insert in lieu thereof the following: "as provided in section 2 of this Act." Line 25, strike out the words "under existing.

Page 8. Strike out all of lines 1 and 2. Line 14, strike out the period and insert a comma and add the following: "and shall furnish copies of any such letters, papers, documents, and public records as said attorneys may desire for use in said case free of cost." Add the following as section 16:

* Sec. 16. This Act shall become effective and binding upon the Chippewa Indians of Minnesota when ratified and accepted by a majority of their general council, the members of which shall be selected at an election held subsequent to the approval of this Act under the supervision of the Secretary of the Interior, but said supervision shall extend no further than to see that every male adult member of the said tribe over 18 years of age is freely permitted to participate in said elections and that this vote is roperly recorded; and that the votes castin o council are properly recorded. ithout such acceptance and ratification this Act shall be inoperative.” Mr. BALLINGER. Mr. Chairman, we will take, as I understand it, as the basis of the legislation, the committee print of the legislative bill. o The first amendment suggested is on page 1, in the title. The title of the bill as it stands is:

A bill to wind up the Affairs of the Chippewa Indians of Minnesota.
The general council suggests in lieu of that this title:

A bill for the preparation of additional rolls, allotments of lands, disposition of the lands and funds of the Chippewa Indians of Minnesota, and for other purposes. That is the object and purpose of the legislation, and they suggest that it would be a more appropriate title. The CHAIRMAN. Is there any objection to that, Mr. Meritt?. Mr. MERITT. Except that the title now in the bill more clearl defines the scope of the proposed legislation contained in the bill. We have no serious objection as to what title is given to the bill, but o I think that the present title is preferable to the title suggested. e CHAIRMAN. Very well, we will pass that. Mr. HENDERSON. May I have just a word, Mr. Chairman, on that ? I think that question concerns the Red Lake Indians directly, and the disposition made by this committee of the Red Lake Indian section would have some effect upon ascertaining and determining whether that was a proper title or not. If the Red Lake Indians stay in this bill on the same footing with the others, it would be proper; otherwise The CHAIRMAN (interposing). What would be proper? Mr. HENDERSON. The proposed amendment. Otherwise I should say that the present title would be more accurate. The CHAIRMAN. We will just say then that that is passed for the resent. p Mr. BALLINGER. Mr. Chairman, the second amendment is on page 1, line 5, after the words “and one by the" insert the words, “executive committee”; and in line 6 reinstate the first two words, viz: “of the.” So that the provision would read as amended, commencing with line 3: “That a commission of three members, one of whom shall be appointed by the President of the United States, one by the Secretary of the Interior, and one by the executive committee of the general council of the Chippewa Indians of Minnesota.” The object and purpose of that amendment is to give a workable proposition. As the bill now stands the member of the commission is to be appointed by the general council. In order to make that appointment it would be necessary to convene a general council of 120 delegates, at a cost probably to the Chippewas of $2,500. They have an executive committee that transacts their business, and this would enable that executive committee at comparatively little cost to the tribe to designate this member of the commission.

Mr. MERITT. The reason we suggested that the words in lines 5 and 6: “President of the '’ be . out is because we thought the general council as a whole should have authority to select the representative of the Indians, rather than a select few of this general council, otherwise the inner circle of the general council would control. The general council holds a meeting annually, and this legislation probably will not pass very early at this session and they will have ample time and opportunity to select their representative on this legislation. Mr. KELLY. Mr. Meritt, as a practical matter, even if they called the general council, it will finally come down to the executive committee anyhow to name. That is a practical thing. Mr. MERITT. If it is left in the language we have suggested, it will be thrown open to the general council as a whole. Mr. KELLY. It would come back to the executive committee anyhow. Then they would have the opportunity to say who would be their representative on this commission in connection with this legislation. It is the same as the theory of the House of Representatives. In theory we can name committees as a Congress. In practice we don't do anything of the kind; we have a committee that brings in the list and Congress ratifies it. It would be the same way here, even if you hold a council, the executive committee would do the same thing there anyhow. lo CHAIRMAN. Mr. Henderson, do you have anything to say on that 2 Mr. HENDERSON. Mr. Chairman, again it depends on whether the Red Lake interests are excluded finally from this bill. If the Red Lake rules are not to be changed by the action of this commission and otherwise, they would have little interest in that provision; if they are to be changed, the Red Lake Indians would prefer that the matter should be open to the council rather than to an executive committee for this reason: I think it has appeared clearly to this committee since the hearings began, that there is a very grave dissatisfaction up there about the general council being truly a representative body, and this would perhaps give more delegates a chance to express their views, or more representatives of the different districts to express their views, than if it were left to a smaller body, the executive committee. Mr. ELSTON. Now that presents the issue and I think we should just pass that. The CHAIRMAN. We will just pass it for the present. I mean that ends it until we have an executive meeting of the committee itself to determine which of these matters we will agree upon, and how we will agree upon them. What is the next? Mr. BALLINGER. Page 2, lines 19, 20, and 21, the council asks to have reinstated the words stricken out. The words stricken out o I will read back at the commencement of the sentence, in ine 14:

Said commission shall immediately proceed to add to the existing allotment rolls of the Chippewa Indians of Minnesota, except the rolls of the Indians residing on and belonging to the Red Lake Reservation and not allotted, the name of any person in being at the time said roll is made and lawfully entitled to an allotment of land, under the agreements entered into with said Indians, pursuant to the provisions of the act approved January 14, 1889.

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