calls himself the minister of the people, and it is certain that his popularity is lately much increased. Lord Shelburne seems to wish to have the management of the treaty, Mr. Fox seems to think, in his department. I hear that the understanding between these ministers is not quite perfect. Mr. Grenville is clever, and seems to feel reason as readily as Mr. Oswald, though not so ready to own it. Mr. Oswald appears quite plain and sincere; I sometimes a little doubt Mr. Grenville. Mr. Oswald, an old man, seems to have no desire but that of being useful in doing good. Mr. Grenville, a young man, naturally desirous of acquiring reputation, seems to aim at that of being an able negociator. Mr. Oswald does not solicit to have any share in the business, but, submitting the matter to Lord Shelburne and me, expresses only his willingness to serve if we think he may be useful, and is equally willing to be excused if we judge there is no occasion for him. Mr. Grenville seems to think the whole negociation committed to him, and to have no idea of Mr. Oswald's being concerned in it, and is, therefore, willing to extend the expressions in his commission so as to make them comprehend America, and this beyond what I think they will bear. I imagine we might, however, go on very well with either of them, though I rather should prefer Oswald; but I apprehend difficulties if they are both employed, especially if there is any misunderstanding between their principals. I must, however, write to Lord Shelburne, proposing something in consequence of his offer of vesting Mr. Oswald with any commission which that gentleman and I should think proper. [1782, June 19: The British Enabling Act, 22 Geo. III, cap. 46, was passed: see appendix to British Case, p. 554.] 47 No. 41.-1782, June 26: Extract from Dr. Franklin's Journal. Went to see Mr. Oswald. I showed him the draft of a letter to be addressed to him instead of Lord Shelburne, respecting the commission or public character he might hereafter be vested with; this draft was founded on Lord Shelburne's memorandums, which Mr. Oswald had shown to me, and this letter was intended to be communicated by him to Lord Shelburne. Mr. Oswald liked the mode, but rather chose that no mention should be made of his having shown me Lord Shelburne's memorandums, though he thought they were given to him for that purpose. So I struck that part out, and new-modelled the letter, which I sent him next day, as follows: TO RICHARD OSWALD, PASSY, June 27, 1782. SIR: The opinion I have of your candor, probity, and good understanding, and good will to both countries, made me hope you would have been vested with the character of plenipotentiary to treat with those from America. When Mr. Grenville produced his first commission, which was only to treat with France, I did imagine that the other to treat with us was reserved for you, and kept only till the enabling bill should be passed. Mr. Grenville has since received a second commission, which, as he informs me, has additional words, empowering him to treat with the ministers of any other prince or state whom it may concern, and he seems to understand that those general words comprehend the United States of America. There may be no doubt that they may comprehend Spain and Holland, but as there exists various public acts by which the government of Britain denies us to be States, and none in which they acknowledge us to be such, it seems hardly clear that we could be intended at the time the commission was given, the enabling act not being then passed. So that though I can have no objection to Mr. Grenville, nor right to make it if I had any, yet as your long residence in America has given you a knowledge of that country, its people, circumstances, commerce, &c., which, added to your experience in business, may be useful to both sides in facilitating and expediting the negociation, I can not but hope that it is still intended to vest you with the character above mentioned, respecting the treaty with America, either separately or in conjunction with Mr. Grenville, as to the wisdom of your ministry may seem best. Be it as it may, I beg you would accept this line as a testimony of the sincere esteem and respect with which, &c. B. FRANKLIN. No. 42.-1782, June 26-30: Extracts from the Duke of Grafton's On the 26th of June a Cabinet was assembled in the morning at my house: ... At another Council in the evening of the same day, it was agreed that, with every testimony of our earnest desire of acting with the Empress of Russia, in the closest connexion, yet, that the armed neutrality cannot be formally admitted. It was also here again explained, that independence to America was offered, in order to obtain peace, or to separate the Americans from their allies. The little prospect we then saw of succeeding in the French negociation, occasioned us to desire as earnestly to bring it to a short issue, as the Court of Versailles was endeavoring to protract it. At a Cabinet held on the 30th, the day previous to that on which Lord Rockingham died, Mr. Fox pressed us earnestly to give separately our opinion on the same point he had urged on Wednesday, relatively to the independence of America being freely granted, even without a treaty for a peace. The majority was for a treaty accompanying the surrender of the claim; but that it was also advisable that independence should in the first instance be allowed, as the basis to treat on. This decision not coming up to Mr. Fox's ideas: he declared, with much regret, that his part was taken to quit his office, which the illness alone of Lord Rockingham occasioned him for the present to hold." No. 43.-1782, July 8: Extract from letter, Mr. Oswald to Lord PARIS Monday 8th July 1782 MY LORD: I beg leave, under this cover, to transmit to your Lordship a letter directed to myself from Dr. Franklin, which he sent me ten days ago, on the day it is dated; and I will also take notice of what passed between him & me in consequence of it. • Lord Rockingham, the Prime Minister, died on 1st July 1782. He was succeeded by Lord Shelburne; Mr. Thomas Townshend becoming Colonial Secretary. Mr. Fox resigned and was followed by others. 1 48 Two days before that letter was sent to me, the doctor called upon me, and said that agreeable to the memorandum I shewed him, he had wrote me a letter which I might send to your Lordship if I thought fit. Uuon the perusal of it, I observed he said that I might be appointed singly for the Colonies, or jointly with Mr. Grenville; or included in Mr. Grenville's general Commission to treat with all parties concerned in the war. Wishing to have an opportunity of talking to him on the subject of it, I went out to his house on Saturday, the 6th, and stayed with him about an hour. After thanking him for his good opinion of me, as expressed in that letter, & giving the reason for its not being forwarded, I told him that this interval of delay had given occasion to sundry questions my own mind as to the business we should have to treat about, in case I should be appointed, & should undertake the office he was pleased to recommend in that letter. in With France and the other parties, I was sensible there must be many points to be settled. But with respect to the Colonies, I told him I could not easily conceive how there could arise any variety of subject to treat upon. That as to a final conclusion, the treaty with France might make it necessary to wait the event of a determination as to them, so as both might be included in one settlement, but until then, I could not see there would be much field for negotiation between Great Britain and the Commisioners of the Colonies, after their Independence had been granted; and which being in a manner acknowledged, I had been in hopes there remained no questions of either side that would require much discussion. If he thought it would be otherwise, I told him I would be much obliged to him, to give me a hint of them, as the question could not but be material to me, in considering whether I might venture upon such a charge. That this I would request of him as a friend, & I hoped I might also expect of him as a friend to England; which I must still suppose him to be. And in which I was not singular believing it was the universal opinion at home, and particularly with regard to your Lordship, who I had reason to be assured had the greatest confidence in his good intentions towards our country. That I did not just then desire, or expect an answer, but if he would name any other day I would wait on him, in hopes of having his opinion and advice upon the particular subject of this Colony Treaty, and his sentiments in general upon the whole of these affairs. Which I was certain would be of service in guiding us how to proceed in the safest and quickest course to a final conclusion of this unhappy business. That I had too just a notion of his character to expect any information but such as would not be inconsistent with particular engagements. But where that did not interfere, his granting the favour I asked might be doing a good office to all parties concerned. For I could not help thinking that the Commissioners of the Colonies had it much in their power to give dispatch to the general Treaty, & to end it on just and reasonable terms, even notwithstanding their particular treaty with France. Upon this the doctor said, they had no treaty with France but what was published. I said I was glad it was so since I saw nothing there, however guarded against a separate peace that should direct or con trol the conditions of a treaty between them and Great Britain, excepting the provision for the great article of Independence which was now out of the question.. After allowing me to go on in this way, he said there were some things which he wished England to think of, or to agree to (I forget which), and yet he should not like that they were known to have been suggested by him. At last he told me, if I would come out to his house on Wednesday, the 10th, he would show me a minute of some things which he thought might be deserving of notice upon the occasion... Meantime he read to me some late resolutions of the Assembly of Maryland in May, just come to hand; declaring against a separate peace, or peace of any kind with England until their independence is acknowledged. PS. . . . He again mentioned the affair of Canada and said there would be no solid peace while it remained an English colony. No. 44.-1782, July 9: Extract from letter, Mr. Grenville to Lord Shelburne. Mr. Franklin the other day, for the first time gave me to understand that America must have her share in the Newfoundland Fishery, and that the limits of Canada would likewise be a subject for arrangement. He seems much disinclined to an idea he expects to be stated, of going into an examination for the mutual compensation of the losses of individuals, insisting, perhaps with reason, upon the endless detail that would be produced by it; No. 45.—1782, July 10: Extract from letter, Mr. Oswald to Lord Shelburne. PARIS Wednesday 10th July 1782. MY LORD: In consequence of Dr. Franklin's appointment, as mentioned in my letter of the 8th under this cover, I went out to his house this morning and stayed near two hours with him, with a view 49 of obtaining the information and advice I wished for, as to the terms and conditions upon which he thought a treaty between Great Britain and the commissioners of the colonies might be carried on, and proceed to a conclusion. Having reminded him of what he in a manner promised on this head on the 6th, he took out a minute, and from it read a few hints or articles. Some he said as necessary for them to insist on; others which he could not say he had any orders about, or were not absolutely demanded, and yet such as it would be advisable for England to offer for the sake of reconciliation, and her future interest, viz. : 1. Of the first class, necessary to be granted. Independence full and complete in every sense to the 13 States, and all troops to be withdrawn from thence. 2. A settlement of the boundaries of their colonies, and the loyal colonies. 3. A confinement of the boundaries of Canada, at least to what they were, before the last Act of Parliament, I think in 1774, if not to a still more contracted State, on an ancient footing. 4. A freedom of fishing on the banks of Newfoundland and elsewhere, as well for fish as whales. I own I wonder'd he should have thought it necessary to ask for this privilege. He did not mention the leave of drying fish on shore in Newfoundland, and I said nothing of it. I don't remember any more articles which he said they would insist on, or what he called necessary for them to be granted. Then as to the advisable articles, or such as he would as a friend recommend to be offered by England, viz.: 1. To indemnify many people who had been ruined by towns burnt and destroyed. The whole might not exceed the sum of five or six hundred thousand pounds. I was struck at this. However, the doctor said, though it was a large sum, it would not be ill-bestowed; as it would conciliate the resentment of a multitude of poor sufferers, who could have no other remedy, and who without some relief, would keep up a spirit of secret revenge and animosity for a long time to come, against Great Britain: whereas a voluntary offer of such reparation, would diffuse an universal calm and conciliation over the whole country. 2. Some sort of acknowledgment in some public Act, of Parliament or otherwise, of our error in distressing those countries so much as we had done. A few words of that kind the doctor said, would do more good than people could imagine. 3. Colony ships and trade to be received and have the same privileges in Britain and Ireland, as British ships and trade. I did not ask any explanation on that head for the present. British and Irish ships in the colonies to be in like manner on the same footing with their own ships. 4. Giving up every part of Canada. He showed me a copy of the enabling Bill as it is called, and said he observed the word revolted was left out and likewise added—– that the purpose of it was to dispense with Acts of Parliament which they were indifferent about, and that now they were better prepared for war, and more able to carry it on than ever they were. That he had heard we entertained some expectation of retaining some sort of sovereignty over them, as His Majesty had of Ireland: and that if we thought so, we should find ourselves much disappointed, for they would yield to nothing of that sort. . . From this conversation I have some hopes, my Lord, that it is possible to put an end to the American quarrel in a short time, and when that is done, I have a notion that a treaty with the other Powers will go more smoothly on. The doctor did not, in the course of the above conversation, hesitate as to a conclusion with them, on account of any connection with those other States; and in general seemed to think their American affair must be ended by a separate Commission. On these occasions I said I supposed, in case of such commission he meant that the power of granting independence, would be therein expressly mentioned. He said, no doubt, I hinted this, thinking it better in the power of treating to include independence, than to grant independence separately, and then to treat about other matters with the commissioners of such independent States, who by such grant are on the same footing with the Ministers of the other Powers. By anything the |