Mr. GIDDINGS. I am willing that the amendment of the gentleman from St. Clair shall be voted upon, before my motion is submitted to a vote. derstandingly. He says "Why all it will read, "the compensation of the stand that he is opposed to our delibthis legislation ?" Why, sir, that is members of the Legislature during the erations here upon what we have to the object of our being here, to legis- session thereof shall be four dollars do. I understand his opposition to late. We should so express our senti- per day." be against such legislation in matters ments upon paper that they may be The CHAIRMAN. There is a mo- of detail, as will tie up the hands of understood; that he who runs may tion pending to strike out all of this the Legislature. I entirely agree with read, and that every man may under- section, except the first sentence. That the sentiments of the gentleman from stand it. I am opposed to all this in- motion would have the precedence, as Kalamazoo in that respect. There tolerable horror of legislation. Gen- it does not relate to the part of the seem to be two extremes here, if I tlemen get up here on this floor and section referred to by the gentleman may so speak, in regard to this subject express themselves perfectly horrified from St. Clair, (Mr. CONGER.) of Constitution making. Those on the at the idea that we are legislating. I one side seem to want the Constitution understand that is the very object for to consist simply of a declaration of which we were sent here. We were sent principles, so far as practicable, and not here to make the organic law of the to include any provisions upon matState, and if any law needs deliberaters of detail, tying up the hands of tion, certainly that law needs deliberathe Legislature any further than may tion and consideration. I am only seem to have been proved to be necesafraid that we shall not legislate sary from past experience. The othenough; that we shall be in too great er extreme seem to be desirous of prohaste to leave here to return to our ceeding to make provision in reference homes, and not do the duty which we to matters of detail, treating the legiswere sent here to perform as it should lative body as a sort of necessary evil, be done. I am not afraid that my to be regulated and restricted in alconstituents will say that we spent too most every particular; to make promuch time here, and that we are fritvision against what seems assumed tering away our time. I am afraid that to be a disposition on the part of that they will censure us for not taking time body to transgress upon the rights of enough, for not deliberating sufficthe people on every occasion where the iently, for not considering properly all Constitution leaves it open for them to the matters which come before us. do so. The CHAIRMAN. That can be done if there is no objection. No objection being made, the question was stated to be upon the amendment of Mr. CONGER. Mr. CONGER. My friend from Macomb, (Mr. MUSSEY,) seems to think that the compensation provided for in this section would run all through the year. Although the committee on the legislative department were not of that opinion, still we are willing to be advised upon the subject. The insertion of the words I have proposed would probably make the meaning of the section more clear. The question was taken upon the amendment of Mr. CONGER, and it was agreed to. I am really astonished that men of sense and understanding should get up here and blaze away so furiously against legislation, when we were sent The question recurred upon the mohere to legislate. That is the object tion of Mr. GIDDINGS, to strike out all of our convening here. Still these but the first sentence of the section. gentlemen get up here and say, Oh, this is all legislation! let us strike out this whole section." I see nothing reprehensible in this section; I think it is good just as it is. I think the gentlemen who reported it here have done their duty, and I shall sustain this section as it came from the committee. I hope it will not be stricken out, or any part of it. Mr. BILLS. I move to amend the portion proposed to be stricken out, by striking out the words "their compensation shall be four dollars per day;" so that the sentence will read, "when convened in extra session, they shall legislate on no other subjects than those expressly stated in the Governor's proclamation, or submitted to them by special message." The question was taken upon the amendment of Mr. BILLS, and it was agreed to. The question then recurred upon the motion of Mr. GIDDINGS. Now, I confess that I belong to the former class of this Convention. I believe that the legislative body of the State of Michigan are just about as virtuous a set of men as usually get. together in any State or nation; that they are as competent judges upon these matters of detail as we are; that they are no more liable to transgress upon the rights of the people, if their hands are not tied, than this body, or any other elected by the people. Following out this idea of these gentlemen who desire to proceed to legislate upon matters of detail in this Convention, following out those views to their natural and legitimate results, we should sit here and proceed to make a complete code of laws, and not form a Constitution merely, and then abolish the legislative department entirely, and leave the legislation of the State hereafter to the boards of supervisors of the different counties; and as a friend near me suggests, "without appeal." Mr. McCLELLAND. I desire to have a vote, at the proper time, taken upon the substitute I proposed to this section. Gentlemen will find that it is precisely the same as section eighteen of the article on the legislative depart- Mr. BLACKMAN. I desire to inment in the Constitution of 1835, ex-quire whether it would be in order to cept that the amount is changed from insert anything in, or to add anything three to four dollars per day, and a to the section, if the motion to strike clause is added providing that when out shall prevail? the Legislature shall be convened in The CHAIRMAN. The Chair is of Although I entirely agree with the extra session they shall legislate on no the opinion that should the motion to views expressed by the gentleman from other subjects than those expressly strike out a portion of this section Kalamazoo, I do not entirely agree submitted to them by the Governor. prevail, it would be in order to insert to his motion to strike out the last part The CHAIRMAN. The substitute any words the committee of the whole of this section, unless it be for the purof the gentleman from Wayne, (Mr. may desire to have inserted. pose of adopting the substitute of the MCCLELLAND,) will be voted upon after Mr. LONGYEAR. I think that gentleman from Wayne, (Mr. Mcthe other propositions have been dis- the gentleman from Oakland, (Mr CLELLAND.) In my view, that substiposed of. VANVALKENBURGH,) in his reply to the tute is the best proposition which has Mr. CONGER. I move to amend gentleman from Kalamazoo, (Mr. GID- been submitted for the perfection of the first sentence of this section by in- DINGS,) misapprehends entirely the this section, with perhaps a single serting after the word "Legislature," force of the argument, and the views addition. during the session thereof;" so that of that gentleman. I do not under- Mr. GIDDINGS. I do not care much what is put in there, if you do not keep in the words that are there now; you cannot make it worse than it is now. they may allow themselves. The fact tleman allow me to make a suggestion is I would rather leave them free to in regard to the Constitution of 1835? fix their own per diem, their ostensible Mr. CONGER. Yes, sir. compensation, than to leave the other Mr. MCCLELLAND. The ConstituMr. LONGYEAR. The substitute matter uncertain, where they can make tion of 1835 did not profess to do anyof the gentleman from Wayne (Mr. allowances to themselves to any extent thing of the kind which he charges. MCCLELLAND) proposes to strike out without the people knowing precisely It provided that members of the Legisthe whole of the section. The addition what is done. I think there is more lature should receive for their services I would make to the substitute would reason for fixing a limit to the per- a compensation to be ascertained by be in regard to the mileage, for the quisites, than to the regular compensa- law. The Legislature was to fix that reason that, with the compensation fixed in the section, it would be doubtful whether the Legislature could make any arrangement about mileage. Mr. McCLELLAND. I will say to the gentleman that mileage was always allowed under the Constitution of 1835, although there was no provision in regard to it in the Constitution. Mr. LONGYEAR. I would prefer to have a provision in reference to mileage embraced in this section, so as to have it fixed, and not leave it to the Legislature entirely. Mr. LONGYEAR. Will the gentleman allow me a single word? tion. compensation. Mr. CONGER. The restriction was three dollars a day, I think. + · Mr. CONGER. As I understand the question, it is to strike out all but the first sentence of this section. It is Mr. MCCLELLAND. The compensaid by the gentleman from Kalamazoo, sation was not to exceed three dollars (Mr. GIDDINGS,) that there is too much a day; but the Legislature was to fix legislation in this article, and the gen- the amount of compensation within tleman has read a portion of an article that limit. from the "New York Post." I had an Mr. CONGER. As I said, there was extract from that paper sent me in a nothing in the Constitution of 1835 to letter, and upon examination I find prevent the Legislature from fixing that the gentleman has read correctly their compensation at three dollars a the last paragraph of the article. I day during the entire term for which intended to use that article for a dif- they were elected. Now, there was an Mr. M. C. WATKINS. I have, per- ferent purpose somewhere; but the object in making the change which haps, as great confidence in the Legis- gentleman seems to have had friends was made by the Convention of 1850. lature as the gentleman from Ingham, abroad, who supplied him with the Gentlemen will remember that on one (Mr. LONGYEAR.) I have also confi- same article, and therefore he has fore- or two, and perhaps on three occasions, dence in the judges of our courts and stalled me, so that my thunder is gone, the sergeant-at-arms left his post here in the other officers of the State. But and not much lightning left. I do not and traveled off in certain directions I am not inclined to allow them to fix myself see any particular incongruity to bring back some forty or fifty doltheir own salaries; neither would I in the language of the section. Not lars' worth of stationery, which perallow the members of the Legislature being the original author of this sec- sons, not members of the Legislature, to fix their own compensation. I think tion, and the committee reporting the had received from their friends in the that matter should be fixed in the Con- article not being the original authors Legislature. I remember it; other stitution. of it, there can be no impropriety in gentlemen probably remember it. In my saying that I think it is very good the Constitution of 1835 there was no language. It expresses in brief words limitation placed upon the amount of exactly what the committee intended stationery which members might proto express, exactly what I desire to vide for themselves. There is a gentlehave in the Constitution. It is much man I think, still living somewhere in more direct and much more specific than this State, who was requested to return the substitute proposed by the gentle- to the Legislature after having travelman from Wayne, (Mr. MCCLELLAND.) led some forty or fifty miles, and Mr. M. C. WATKINS. I think it is For instance, the first line of this section to bring back some stationery here very proper that the Constitution is as follows: "The compensation of the which some friends had provided should fix the compensation, mileage, members of the Legislature shall be him with. Perhaps my friend and perquisites of the members of the four dollars per day." The gentleman from Wayne, (Mr. McCLELLAND,) may Legislature. I do not know but the from Macomb, (Mr. MUSSEY,) raised recollect the circumstance. I think it substitute proposed by the gentleman the question whether under that clause occurred somewhere in the neighborfrom Wayne would do that also. But members of the Legislature would not hood of the county of Wayne, perhaps I am entirely opposed to the proposi- be allowed four dollars a day during in some one of the adjoining counties. tion of the gentleman from Kalamazoo, the whole two years of their term. But, I will even go so far as to say that it (Mr. GIDDINGS.) I would no more section eighteen of the article on the was somewhere bordering on the St. leave the Legislature to fix their com- legislative department, in the Constitu- Clair river. Although that may hit my pensation, than I would leave that tion of 1835 was no limitation. It pro- county a little, still I will say that it matter to any other State, county or vided only that members of the Legis- was somewhere on that river that the township officers. I think that matter lature should receive three dollars a gentleman resided who took that stashould be fixed definitely in the Con- day. There never was any pretense tionery off with him. under the section that they might reMr. BLACKMAN. I desire to say a ceive three dollars per day for every word or two in regard to this matter. day of their term. I think there was I am in favor of a limitation being never any question raised in regard to placed in the Constitution in regard to that matter. If there was, the prothe perquisites which the Legislature posed substitute is objectionable to the may allow themselves, as well as in re- same extent as the first line of the secgard to their regular compensation. Ition. I therefore call the attention of can see no reason against limiting their my friend from Macomb to that, so compensation, which would not apply that it may be corrected. equally well to limiting the perquisites Mr. McCLELLAND. Will the gen Mr. M. C. WATKINS. Yes, sir. Mr. LONGYEAR. That was my proposition. I was in favor of the substitute of the gentleman from Wayne, (Mr. MCCLELLAND,) which does limit the compensation. stitution. When the Convention of 1850 met, that fact was recollected. Provision was made that in future the Legislature should not be deprived of the services of the sergeant-at-arms, by his going off to look up the stationery of the State. It was not so much to prevent the loss of the stationery, as it was to prevent the loss of the services of the sergeant-at-arms. That was one reason for the restriction which was tion of 1850 effectually provided for that sort of traveling stationery. It was thought to be a very good provision. There is nothing of that sort in the proposed substitute, and the same difficulty might occur again under that substitute; there might be the same tendency to activity and liveliness in the stationery of the State as before; it might go off without any provision of law. The last clause of the section is The gentlemen of the Convention of 1852 had reason for inserting that clause. There was necessity for it at that time, and there is a necessity for it now. The only remaining part about which there is any particular trouble, is that in relation to mileage. The question of mileage has been a trouble- sion to travel over it. some one in other bodies than the State Mr. CONGER. Still that is not the Legislature. It has created some "usually travelled route" from DeWitt Mr. HENDERSON. The substitute trouble even in the national councils, to Lansing. The gentleman has, there- of the gentleman from Wayne, (Mr. where the wisest of the wise gather fore, no right to make that inquiry. MCCLELLAND,) proposes to strike out together; it has created a great deal of But, seriously, all this talk about legis- this entire section, and leave the quesannoyance there, and has been a mat-lation in the Constitution has no appli- tion of compensation to the Legislature. ter of a great deal of criticism by the cation to this section at all. This is a Mr. LONGYEAR. Does not the people all over the United States. If restriction and a limitation upon the substitute of the gentleman from Wayne ten cents a mile is not sufficient, when Legislature itself. It is not legislating provide that the compensation of memby our laws we restrict railroads to three about matters in the State, but prescrib-bers of the Legislature shall not exceed cents a mile for passengers traveling ing rules which shall control the Legisla- four dollars per day? ture; and with all due respect for the The CHAIRMAN. The Chair will ficient for traveling, and little inciden- Legislature, and for the members state the nature of the substitutes now tal expenses connected therewith, then thereof, I think if it is proper to fix their pending. The substitute of the genpay, it is proper to fix their mileage, tleman from Barry, (Mr. WRIGHT,) is and the perquisites of office. This follows: section, notwithstanding the committee on arrangement and phraseology have the supervision of our work, this secMr. CONGER. I do not know tion, with the amendments that have whether I would or not. But I do not been made to it here, expresses in just That seems to relate entirely to comprofess to have all the wisdom that as perfect and concise language as can pensation. The substitute of the genwas possesed by those who did frame be used exactly what the committee tleman from Wayne leaves the manner the Constitution of the United States. desire. If this committee of the of compensation to the Legislature, and If I remember aright, even those ven- whole choose to make other provisions restricts them from an increase of their erable old men, after they had come if they choose to alter this that is compensation during the term for through the fires of the revolution, did another thing. But I deny that this which they were elected, and also recondescend to introduce in the Consti- section is clumsily expressed, that it is stricts them to four dollars per day. tution of the United States such a ungrammatical, that there can be any The question, however, now is upon question as mileage; and provided that question about its meaning, or that it the amendment of the gentleman from each of the members of Congress, at all corresponds with Talleyrand's Kalamazoo, (Mr. GIDDINGS.) The deshould have for mileage the pay of one idea that words were to be used only bate perhaps should be allowed to extend to all matters before the comday for every twently miles traveled. to conceal ideas. My friend certainly is too learned in Now, to come to the proposition be-mittee upon this subject. Vol. 2-No. 9. Mr. GIDDINGS. I desire to ask a question. Mr. CONGER. I do not wish to give way any longer. I will give way by-and-by, after I have collected my thoughts a little. Mr. GIDDINGS.. I rise to a point of order then. The question under discussion is my proposition to strike out all of the section but the first sentence. The gentleman from St. Clair, (Mr. CONGER,) is speaking upon a proposition which is not now before the Convention. The CHAIRMAN. The Chair will state in reference to the point of order, that the gentleman from St. Clair is discussing this section generally. He is illustrating what he wants to say by a reference to the first sentence of the section, which provides specifically for the compensation, as well as to the other parts of the section, which provides for other things relating to the pay of members. ture would ever be very likely to cut it Constitutions of other States to ascer- of the Legislature would satisfy their Mr. McCLELLAND. Will the gen- Mr. CONGER. I have no objection so that it is not taken out of my time. [Laughter.] Mr. MCCLELLAND. The provision of the Constitution of the United States Mr. CONGER. I am informed that I am mistaken on that point; I am told My own idea of the proper amount that the clause to which I referred is of compensation is not expressed in in an act of Congress, instead of the this section. But the amount here Constitution of the United States. I fixed was what the committee thought admit that I was mistaken. My imwas proper, and I agreed to let it go. pression was that the Constitution proI myself would have fixed the compen- vided that the mileage of a member of Mr. CONGER. It would be a very sation of member of the Legislature Congress should be at the rate of easy matter, even in the case of my at five dollars per day. If the people one day's pay for every twenty miles learned friend, who has gained confi- send to the Legislature a man of busi- traveled; that, however, only shows dence from his position in the courts, ness habits, and capacity, and talent, that I am human like the rest of the and has familiarized himself to public who at home requires for his services, gentlemen, for "to err is human." It speaking, for me to interrupt him with even while living at home without any brings me within the scope of humy feeble abilities, and disturb the extra expense, from three to five, or manity, where I desire to be placed. strength and coherency of his argu- ten dollars a day, then I think he Mr. McCLELLAND. If the genment with all his power and intel- should have something commensurate tleman from St. Clair will permit, I will lectual might. to the value of his services to pay him read the provision of the Constitution But that a modest man like myself for his services in the Legislature; not of the United States which relates to should be interrupted with no earthly so much as he was making at home, the compensation of members of Conobject under heaven except annoyance, not so much as to make it an object on and to interrupt a discussion which account of the salary, but at least has been allowed to go on uninter- enough to partly compensate him for rupted until I commenced, I think is his loss of time, and the injury to his not altogether fair. The gentleman business. But I will propose no amendfrom Kalamazoo acts under the impulse ment to that effect. of a little feeling. I excuse him, for Now, I will so far gratify the gentle-upon this subject will be found on page like myself, he is a little impulsive. I man from Ingham, (Mr. LONGYEAR) 16 of the Manual, and is as follows: propose to discuss all the matter now and the gentleman from Kalamazoo, "The Senators and Representatives shall under consideration so as not to be re- (Mr. GIDDINGS,) as to confine myself receive a compensation for their services to quired to rise too often, and to speak to the matter immediately pending. be ascertained by law, and paid out of the too much. I was speaking to the pro- Is it desirable that we should strike treasury of the United States." posed substitute of the gentleman from out the portion of this section which Wayne, (Mr. MCCLELLAND.) When the gentleman from Kalamazoo prothere is a motion to strike out, and poses to strike out? This committee there is a substitute held in abeyance, have decided, by a very large majority, I take it that I have a right to discuss that it is not desirable to strike out the two propositions, and, to give my that part of the section. This commitreasons for or against them. I was tee have decided that when the Legissaying that the compensation fixed in lature shall be convened in extra sesthis section for members of the Legis- sion, they shall legislate on no other lature was four dollars a day during subjects than those stated in the Govthe session. I was going on to say ernor's proclamations, or submitted to that the substitute proposed by the them by special message. I think the gentleman from Wayne does not limit good sense of this committee of the the compensation to the session. whole will see that it is not desirable I was going on to say that the pro- to strike out that part of this section, posed substitute fixed a limit above especially when it is borne in mind which the compensation should not go. that we have now decided to have anNow, coming to that point, I desire to nual sessions. Now, is it desirable to suggest to this committee that, if the fix in the Constitution the mileage of limitation was fixed at ten dollars a members of the Legislature? I have day, no man believes that the Legisla- not spent my time in looking over the This is very nearly the same as the provision which was contained in the Constitution of 1835 of this State. Mr. CONGER. That is so, then. Well, my view of the Constitution of the United States was good for my argument as I was making it. Finding my mistake, and reading the Constitution as it actually is, I find that it is very good for my argument as I make it now. [Laughter.] It is the same provision which the gentleman from Wayne proposes to put in our Constitution now. Yet, I submit to gentlemen here, who are old members of Congress, and to other gentlemen of this Convention, whether that question of mileage has not been a continual source of irritation in the Congress of the United States, from the time of the adoption of the Constitution of the United States down to the time when of. It may be so with other parts of knowledge of every gentleman present the compensation of members of Con- the State, where we do not expect so who has been a member of the Legisgress was fixed at an annual salary? much morality, if we do not have this lature, that the rule referred to in the It ought to have been fixed in the Con- restriction. stitution, if it was not. "The compensation of members of the Legislature shall be three dollars per day for actual attendance, and when absent on account of sickness." Constitution of 1850 is never enforced ་་ He was paid for : It was Mr. LOVELL. I desire to ask the Is ten cents a mile too much? I chairman of the committee on the legissay that mileage should be fixed in this lative department, why that committee Constitution. It is not a proper mat- omitted certain words which are to ter to be left for the Legislature to de- be found in the Constitution of 1850. termine. The members of the Legis-On page 8 of the Manual, section fiflature do not desire it shall be left to teen, article IV of the Constitution of them, or if they do, the people do not 1850, will be found this provision: desire it. Now is ten cents a mile too much? If it is then reduce it. Is it too little? Then increase it. But fix it in the Constitution at some rate. The section under consideration Mr. CONGER. If I recollect, it was There should be limitations and re- seems to contemplate that members the case of the Senator from the UpNow, when you say strictions upon the Legislature, in re- shall recieve the same pay when absent, per Peninsula. gard to their compensation, their mile- no matter on what occasion, as when that the person shall be paid for actage, and their perquisites of office. present. It seems to me, from the ual attendance, it is very difficult to The whole history of this State shows little consideration I have given to this tell how you shall apply that rule. If that before these things were fixed, subject, it would be very desirable for there is a committee sent to visit an there were continual encroachments the State to employ members of the asylum, or sent away from actual atupon the rights of members and upon Legislature, and perhaps all other pub- tendance on the Legislature, if this the people, by the appropriation of lic servants, precisely as people ordi- rule is applied strictly, they can draw stationery, books and other things narily employ others to perform services no pay. If a member goes away for a from the State, for members and their for them. If I employ a man to labor day or two, it is not certain that he is friends. The gentleman from Wayne for me in any capacity, and he is taken not in the service of the State. The will remember that the records will sick, that is usually his loss and not Legislature has never applied the rule show the amounts of old bills, which mine. If his indisposition is an in- to a member in such a case. were paid by the State. Our own disposition to serve me, and a disposi- thought by the committee that this recollections will remind us that there tion to attend to business of his own, provision was useless in the Constituwere old bills for liquid stationery paid I certainly should never think of pay- tion; it was rather an occasion for an by the State, under the Constitution of ing him. I would myself rather see indirect violation of the Constitution, For that 1835. The paper in those days was the compensation fixed a little higher, than a practical benefit. firm and thick, and held liquids in if it is any object, though I do not reason the committee struck it out, large quantities. [Laughter.] And propose to ask that it shall be over leaving it to each House of the Legismembers' bills in some cases, amounted four dollars a day; but I would like to latue to decide in what cases compento from forty to two hundred and see the members of the Legislature sation should be allowed when memthirty-six dollars for stationery, which paid for their work, and not paid when bers were absent, and in what cases it was said in the common language of they are indisposed to work. I sup- should not be allowed, as was done in the people, to apply to a great deal of pose it has happened with members of the Senate during the last session of That is the only fluid matter, and not writing fluid the Legislature heretofore, as it has the Legislature. with members of this Convention, that reason that I know of for changing Perhaps that is all that I ought to there has been very little indisposition the language of the section in that resay on the subject. Perhaps it is more on account of sickness, but consider- spect; that for all practical purposes it than it becomes me to say. But I felt able indisposition on account of private has been, and will be a dead letter in that it was due to the gentleman from business, and other sorts of indisposi- the Constitution, no matter what we Wayne, that I should refer him to the tion which, perhaps, need not be men- may say; an occasion in the opinion of good old times, when these things tioned, but which have taken members some, for the violation of the Constituneeded a little restriction, a trifling away. Now, members may find it tion, and no practical benefit. My restriction; when some of the smartest necessary to be away; but if they are own idea is, that if a member is genand shrewdest men of the State, ac-away attending to their business, and erally in attendance upon the Legislaknowledged by us to be so, were mem- not to the business of the State, then ture, or upon the Convention here, bers of the Legislature, and had large why should the State pay them? In having left his business for the purpose bills for stationery as I have described. other words, why should the State of being here, perhaps provided for I wanted to refer him to the time adopt a rule in employing its servants, somebody else to attend to his busiwhen one gentleman started from this which private corporations, or individ-ness during the whole term, and he capitol, got into an adjacent county-uals, never adopt? Why not fix the should be gone for a day or two poshe did not go off on the railroad, compensation for the actual labor per- sibly upon matters connected with his I believe, but on the plank road-with formed, at the price which the actual business here, or it may be upon a large amount of stationery, which labor should command, and say that ters connected with his own private was taken and brought back here. He they shall be paid only for their actual business, there is no necessity for limitwas not a member of the Legislature, labor? I suppose there is a reason for ing his compensation on that account. however; that was furnished to him by omitting that provision. And, hence I A man may be away from the Convena friend who was in the Legislature. ask the chairman of the committee tion or the Legislature, for a day or two I think these things might happen why those words were left out. now and then, and still be more useful again, even with persons along the St. during the days that he is here, than Clair river; the last place in the world some other men who are never out of where such a thing would be thought their seats or away during the session. either. Mr. CONGER. I will answer the question of the gentleman from Genesee, (Mr. LOVELL.) It is within the mat |