Senator MORGAN. The Atlas concession is for the exclusive navigation of the river? Professor HAUPT. Yes, sir. I understand, not authoritatively, that the offer to purchase the railroad concessions has not been closed. Senator WILSON. I wish just to ask a question for my own pleasure, although I think you have answered it in a dozen forms. In the first place, I have it from men of as high reputation as yourself that the construction and building of this canal is entirely a feasible enterprise. Professor HAUPT. Yes, sir; it is. There is no question about it. Senator WILSON. It is your judgment, as an engineer, and with your knowledge and information and experience, that this is a feasible route, and that the canal can be constructed? Professor HAUPT. It is, unquestionably. If it is done it will be a work of thankfulness to you and your children and your children's children and your children's grandchildren. Senator HARRIS. It is the opening of the door of civilization to countries west of us. Professor HAUPT. Unquestionably. Senator HARRIS. I am exceedingly pleased with the Professor and with what he has told us. Senator MORGAN. I am delighted with it. Senator WILSON. His statement has been exceedingly interesting. Professor HAUPT. I am very glad to have had an opportunity to say a word in behalf of my country. The committee adjourned. FRIDAY, June 17, 1898. The committee met at half past 10 o'clock a. m. STATEMENT OF GENERAL PETER C. HAINS. The CHAIRMAN (Senator MORGAN). General, what length of time did you spend in Nicaragua the past year? General HAINS. Three months. We arrived there the latter part of December, about the 20th of December, I think, and we left about the 20th of March. Senator MORGAN. That included the dry season? General HAINS. Yes, sir; it was the dry season on the west side, but it was the latter part of the wet season on the east side. Senator MORGAN. How did you find the temperature and the climate as to healthfulness? General HAINS. You mean on the west side? Senator MORGAN. Or the east side-any part of it. General HAINS. On the west side the climate was delightful. It was a little warm, but not uncomfortable. On the east side there was more humidity in the air, and while the climate is warm the thermometer does not range high, and if you keep still you feel very comfortable. It is debilitating, however, when you exercise to any great extent. Senator MORGAN. It is a tropical climate with trade winds supplying a constant current of fresh air? General HAINS. Yes, sir. Of course the trade winds are not constant, but they blow a great deal of the time and make it very comfortable. It is a much pleasanter climate than I expected to find. Senator MORGAN. What opinion did you form of the harbor at Brito and the chance of excavating a harbor at the mouth of the Rio Grande River and the Mangrove swamp? General HAINS. There is not the slightest trouble of forming a harbor there. Senator MORGAN. For the accommodation of as many ships as would want to use the canal? General HAINS. Yes, sir; a harbor can be formed there that will accommodate all the commerce that will ever wish to use the canal. Senator MORGAN. Will it be done by breakwaters or by dredging, or both? General HAINS. I looked at that with especial care. I have an idea that the best way is to have a single breakwater, not very long; or rather a jetty instead of a breakwater, and to excavate the harbor really at the mouth of the canal; that is, on the mainland. Senator MORGAN. And that is at the mouth of the Rio Grande, is it not? General HAINS. That will be right close to the mouth of the Rio Grande. This plan of mine, I would say, will reduce the cost considerably on the estimate of the last board. Senator MORGAN. You call that the Ludlow board? General HAINS. Yes, sir. Senator MORGAN. You would dispense with the extensive breakwater that that board contemplated? General HAINS. Yes, sir; I do not think it would be necessary with the arrangement that I propose there. Senator MORGAN. Is the water deep off the shore there? General HAINS. Yes, sir; it falls off very deep. Senator MORGAN. And rapidly? General HAINS. Yes, sir; rapidly. Senator MORGAN. Did you find any rock in the way of navigation or shipping there? General HAINS. Not for this harbor that I would propose. There are no rock indications. Senator MORGAN. Did the borings made in this swamp indicate how deep you could go before you would strike the rock? General HAINS. Borings have been made there, but where we locate the harbor there are no indications of rock in any of the borings that have been taken. Senator MORGAN. So you would find no obstruction in making the' harbor there? General HAINS. No, sir; no obstruction. There is no trouble whatever in making a first-rate harbor on the west coast, not the slightest. I do not hesitate to say that. Senator MORGAN. Now, coming inland to Tola Basin, is it your idea that there is a choice of plan there between establishing a great dam to raise the water to the lake level and a basin and the alternative of a canal with locks leading down to the mouth of the Rio Grande? General HAINS. Yes, sir; I think there is a great choice there. General HAINS. My preference would be a canal right straight from the lake to Brito. Senator MORGAN. About how many locks would you think it would take between the lake and Brito? General HAINS. The number of locks would depend somewhat on circumstances. I am rather inclined to think that very large locks with high lift are not good things to rely on. Senator MORGAN. Not safe? General HAINS. No; 1 do not think they are hardly safe to rely on. It depends a good deal on the character of the foundation. I think, without giving the matter sufficient study to definitely determine it, I should rather prefer a greater number of locks than are proposed, say about five, with about 20 feet lift. Senator MORGAN. A greater number would probably add something to the expense? General HAINS. Not a great deal, Senator. You save so much on the excavation and embankment that really, when it comes to a question of the number of locks, the number of locks does not figure as such a large item in the cost of the whole canal. Senator MORGAN. I suppose that your view of it corresponds somewhat with one that I happen to entertain, which is that the true economy in the construction of the canal is, first of all, security. General HAINS. That is it. Senator MORGAN. With good results. General HAINS. And that is the reason why I would rater take what they call the low-level canal. is? Senator MORGAN. Because that has been tried and we know what it General HAINS. We know exactly what we can do with it. Senator MORGAN. I fully agree with you about that. That would take you down, practically, on the left bank of the Rio Grande, would it not? General HAINS. Yes; I would start in on the left bank from Brito. The river I would leave by itself. I would not allow the river to interfere with my canal at all. Senator MORGAN. You would fence off the river entirely? General HAINS. I would fence it off. Senator MORGAN. And rely entirely upon the lake water for your canal? General HAINS. Well, of course you know you will have the sea. Senator MORGAN. I mean the sea water and the lake water. General HAINS. Yes, sir. Senator MORGAN. They would meet. Did you find any practical engineering difficulty between Brito and the lake? General HAINS. Not the slightest; that is, for a low-level canal. Senator MORGAN. Is the soil of the country adapted to the construction of a secure canal there? General HAINS. Yes, sir; I think there is no trouble whatever so far as the soil is concerned. Senator MORGAN. Now, when you enter the lake from the canal, coming to the eastward, are there any difficulties of an engineering sort there in regard to making a safe entrance into the canal from the lake? General HAINS. No difficulties that are not encountered everywhere in the works of that kind. Senator MORGAN. The trades blowing across the lakes persistently toward the west of course would give the drift of water against the western shore of the lake? General HAINS. Yes, sir. The waves come in there so nearly normal to the shore that there is very little what we call littoral drift; and then the bottom is mostly rocky. A good deal of it is hard, and some of it is rocky, and it does not erode very easily. Senator MORGAN. You can make a substantial structure there, then, without difficulty? General HAINS. Oh, yes; there is no trouble about making an easy entrance to that portion of the canal. Senator MORGAN. The reason why I mention the point at all is because there has been some apprehension that the canal would be difficult to enter from the lake there. Somehow, that never impressed me as being a very important matter, but others attach importance to it, and therefore I wanted to have it explained. General HAINS. I see no difficulty whatever in entering the canal from the lake. Senator MORGAN. Now, passing across the lake, your examination of that part of the line was interrupted, I understand, by hostilities between Costa Rica and Nicaragua? General HAINS. Yes, to a certain extent. There never has been a complete survey of the lake to determine its area within anything like approximately correct limits, you know; and some of our work was interfered with. We expected to get one of the Government's vessels. There are only two on the lake. On account of the breaking out of the war we could not get her. Senator MORGAN. Were your operations there otherwise interrupted by the war? General HAINS. Yes, sir; very much. They were very much interfered with. Senator MORGAN. Is there any difficulty of navigation in the body of the lake between the point where the canal leaves the lake to go toward Brito and the exit at the mouth, or, rather, the head, of the San Juan River? General HAINS. There are no difficulties that we have discovered. Senator MORGAN. There is deep water? General HAINS. There is deep water for the greater part of the way. Senator MORGAN. There is shoal water there for 14 or 15 miles, I suppose! General HAINS. Yes, on the east side of the lake. The shoals extend out a good long distance; I do not remember just exactly how far, but I think 12 or 13 miles. Senator MORGAN. That is just a deposit of silt, is it not? General HAINS. Yes, sir. Senator MORGAN. Is there any stone appearing amongst it? Senator MORGAN. Then in that reach from the mouth of the river toward the point at which the canal would leave the lake your engineering party, the hydrographers, or some persons, found, as I understand it, a lead or channel that would shorten the distance of dredging? General HAINS. Yes, sir; it does shorten the distance somewhat, but I do not apprehend that that will affect the quantities of excavation very greatly. It will affect them somewhat. It shortens it some 2 or 3 miles, I think, but there is very little dredging to be done on that outer part anyway. Senator MORGAN. It is on the outer part of what you call the shoal or silt? General HAINS. Yes, sir. Senator MORGAN. What is your computation, if you have made one, of the superficial area of the two lakes, Managuay and Nicaragua? General HAINS. We have made, from the best information we could get, some computations for the area of the lake, but I can not tell how reliable they are. They make Lake Nicaragua about what the Ludlow board estimated it-about 2,700 square miles-and Lake Managua, I think, is roughly estimated at about one-seventh of that. Senator MORGAN. The level of Managuay is about 17 or 18 feet above Nicaragua, is it not? General HAINS. Yes, sir. Senator MORGAN. Did you examine the outlet between the two lakes? General HAINS. No, sir. Senator MORGAN. Managuay may be considered, then, as a water feeder to Nicaragua? General HAINS. Yes, to a certain extent; but the relative areas are such that we can not expect to get very much water from Managuay into Lake Nicaragua. Seven feet loss of depth in Managuay would add only one to Nicaragua. Senator MORGAN. It is that way? The bed of the lake is higher? General HAINS. Well, the level of the water. I do not know just what the depth is, but I understand that Lake Managuay is rather shoal. Senator MORGAN. Now, General, if you will give us some idea of your view of the San Juan River as an available part of the canal that is to be constructed and the difficulties, of course, that you would encounter in canalization, we shall be obliged to you. General HAINS. I would not know how to answer that question. If you will ask me specific questions I will answer them. Senator MORGAN. I will ask you, first of all, in constructing a ship canal across Nicaragua from ocean to ocean, would you select the channel of the San Juan River in preference to a land route, if you had such a route? General HAINS. I would for a part of the distance. The upper San Juan would naturally be used for any canal that you build across there. You would naturally use the portion of the river down as far as the vicinity of the mouth of the San Carlos. Senator MORGAN. You could not construct on either bank of the San Juan a canal that would be equivalent, I suppose, in its cheapness to take the place of one where the actual line of the canal would be in the river? General HAINS. I do not think it would be as cheap to build a canal from the lake down as far as the vicinity of the San Carlos River as it would be to improve the river itself. Senator MORGAN. There is no controversy on that point? General HAINS. I do not think anybody would controvert that question. Senator MORGAN. What difficulties would you find in going from the exit of the San Juan River down, say, to the mouth of the San Carlos? What difficulties or obstructions would be in the way? General HAINS. The difficulties are the rapids in the San Juan River. Senator MORGAN. There are five of those? General HAINS. I do not remember exactly the number; the Toro Rapids, the Castillo. Senator MORGAN. The Machuca? General HAINS. The Machuca. Senator MORGAN. That is three, and then there are two smaller ones, I think. I suppose those difficulties would be overcome partly by flooding and partly by dredging? General HAINS. Yes, sir. It all depends, however, on how you go at it to treat the case on that side of the river. There are various means of doing it. There is the old Childs project; then there is the Lull project, and then there is the Menocal project. There are two Menocal projects, in fact-a low level from somewhere near Ochoa, and also the short cut right across the divide. |