Q. Suppose this contract was let at the time you made that bid -this contract under which this work is done-would you say those walls were worth $14 per thousand? A. Yes sir. Q. Suppose Mr. Clark (the man who put up the walls) and this man who measured them (Bolin-Starck), should come forward, and Clark who measured every wall as they went up: the thickness, hight and all, and give their measurements-which man would you rely upon the most? A. In the face of such a large discrepancy I should have the thing just measured right up. It can all be arrived at, within a hundred brick, with the exception of the outside wall; there might be a liberal allowance there. Q. If Clark would come forward with his books and show the measurement of every wall, as it went up, and this other man would come forward with what he showed you this morning, which would you rely upon the most? A. One of the gentlemen I never saw in my life, and my acquaintance with the other is limited. I should have to have something to base my opinion upon, and I have not got it. Q. Which man would have the best opportunity of being correct-the man that put the walls up and made the figures and kept them every day, or the other man? A. With regard to the outside walls: the man that put them up. In the other walls there would be no difference; it can be measured now as well as at any time. Q. You simply base your judgment upon what Bolin-Starck told you. You saw none of his figures? A. Q. That is true. Suppose it turns ont that he has no qualifications, and is a rogue generally, what would be your opinion then? A. I would not think anything of him-I would not take his statements. Re-examination by Mr. ROBERTS: Q. I will ask you, if you measure these outside walls, solid brick and stone, then deduct the number of cubic feet of stone, would not that give the number of brick? A. Yes sir, of course. Vol. I-107 By Mr. BEVERIDGE: Q. You would have to make some allowance for the projections upon the outside? A. Yes sir. Examination by Mr. BOBINSON, continued: (Some specimens of mortar attached to broken pieces of brick, taken from the walls of the State House, shown) Q. Give your opinion whether that is good mortar or not? A. That seems to be very good mortar. There appears to be a little dry sand in there. Q. How long, ordinarily, does it take mortar to get hard and set in walls of that thickness? A. Mortar ought to set in at the rate of an inch per month, until you get up to a wall that is two feet thick. I don't think, however, that would be as hard in two years as it would eventually become, because I have observed that the oldest walls are the hardest. Examination by Mr. MCMILLAN, on behalf of the Commission ers: Q. I understand that a contractor, doing brick work, can't do so much work-that is, his hands can't do so much work—in a given length of time, using bad mortar, as they can if they use good, rich mortar. A. That is true. Q. Then I would ask you this question. What inducement is there, to a contractor, to use bad imortar? Is there any pecuniary inducement? A. There might be a mortar made out of certain kinds of lime and sand, that would work very well; a man could do an ordinary day's work with it, and it might have the appearance of being pretty good mortar, and afterwards disappoint expectations with regard to it. Using quick-lime and good, clean, sharp sand, there is no inducement at all to put in an extra quantity of sand, because all that is saved in the lime is lost in the labor. Examination by Mr. ROBINSON, continued: Q. Do you know Barnard as a contractor? Q. Do you know what his character is as a contractor? A. My impression of him is favorable. I have met him only a few times. SANFORD LORING sworn, and examined by MR. ROBERTS, as Q. How long have you been engaged in that business? A. It is about fifteen years since I first worked in an architect's office. Q. Have you examined the work upon this new State House? A. I called there this morning, early, and walked over the building. Q. Did you make any A. Yes, sir. examination of the work? Q. State what that examination was, and the result of it. A. My attention was called to the character of the brick work, and more particularly to the character of the mortar. I found a great deal of good work there, and a great deal that I call bad work. I found in the west part of the building there, the walls, or the mortar in the walls, was rather inferior. On the other part of the building it appeared to be very good, indeed. The brick work and mortar in the basement is excellent. Q. What is the cause of the defect in the walls you found defec ▼ ? A. I don't know that I could give the cause; I would not attempt to do that; I only know the work. I should not accept such work in Chicago, because there is no occasion there for ever having that kind of work. The material is of such a character that I never discovered anything of the kind there. By Mr. BEVERIDGE: Q. Buildings never fall down in Chicago, do they? D A. Oh yes, such things have happened, but not because we didn't have good mortar. By Mr. ROBERTS: Q. What was the cause of the Court House falling down? A. The Court House didn't fall; it was the iron work-the roof; there was too much roof and too much snow. Q. What was the cause of that mortar being bad ? A. I don't know, sir; I only know it is what I call bad mortar. Q. Did was made? you examine the lime and sand of which that mortar A. I examined some sand there that I was told was used in the building; there was some lime there which I should hope was not used. I didn't see any good lime about the premises; I saw a large pile of lime there which I took to be rubbish; it was in the basement; I didn't see any other there. Mr. Robinson stated that the lime referred to was waste lime, that had been slacked and hardened, and could not be used. Q. State what you saw of sand there. A. I saw the two piles of sand; one seemed as though it had been washed; it was clean sand; it was as clean sand as I would expect to see. There was another pile of sand there that I would call loam sand; we do not allow people to use that kind of sand if we can help it. Q. Is that loam sand good. A. I would not allow it to be used in a building of mine. If the sand was used with cement, as I judge it has been, from the appearance of the wall below, it would make good mortar; but I never saw any good mortar made from that kind of sand used with quick lime. Q. What proportion of those walls do you consider good, and what proportion bad. A. That is difficult to tell, because I didn't examine with a view of finding that out. When I went there this morning I hardly knew what I went for, except as my attention was called to this thing and that thing about the building. (Specifications attached to contract shown.) Q. Examine those specifications and state how that work corresponds with the specifications. A. I see it says, all brick wall above, to be laid with mortar composed of one part of cement, one part of lime slacked at least one week before using, and five parts of clean, sharp sand. I should judge a portion of that work was not laid up according to that specification. It says, "all inside cellar brick walls, to the hight of the present outside walls, will be laid with mortar composed of one part of cement and three parts of clean, sharp sand." There is a very marked difference between the mortar in the walls and that called for by that specification. There is not much dif ference between the kinds of mortar called for in these two specifications. Q. State whether, in your judgment, if they had used the in gredients provided in the specifications, of good quality, in the proportions stated, it would have made good work. A. Yes, sir, I should expect it to make good mortar. Q. State if the mortar in which those walls above the cellar was made in accordance with those specifications? A. I should say not; a portion of it. Q. What proportion has been laid in accordance with the specifications, and what proportion has not been? A. I could not state, as I did not examine it carefully enough; I saw a large quantity of the work in the west portion of the building, of which I should say the mortar was not made according to the specifications; that upon the east side-I should say there has been cement used there. Q. Will that which you examined ever make a first class job? A. I would rather answer that question ten years hence. A. I should very much prefer to have a different class of work. I should not expect to see it improve very much in time, but having had no experience with that class of work I can not say whether it will grow harder or not. Q. Would it be a first class job of work if it was as good as the east wall. A. Yes, sir. Q. State whether, in your judgment, it is proper to erect so large and so expensive a building, upon walls such as they are? A. I should prefer to leave the walls as they are upon the east side. I would prefer to take them down and relay them. It would depend upon what is going to be done above. I was there this morning and just passed over the work, and a person who would pretend to pass judgment after inspecting those walls but a few hours, would do what I would not do. Q. Have you examined the general plans by which this State House is to be built? A. Yes, sir. Q. Can you approximate the cost of the State House after it is finished according to the plans and specifications? |