Q. job. State whether it is likely to grow better-to make a good A. Don't think it will ever set. Mr. BUNN, Commissioner Are you still of opinion that the walls would fall down? Mr. BUNN: Q. You said they would crush ont. A. I think so now. By Mr. ROBERTS : Q. What is the rule with regard to good mortar? A. It will harden and make a solid mass. Mr. BEVERIDGE, Commissioner Q. If that was a brick [illustrating with one of three specimens on the table] from the very softest part of the wall, and the mortar there became that hard, would the other part of the wall become as hard? A. (Taking a specimen and examining.) There is something to be noticed there to a very large extent. There are pockets there now, which are nothing but clean sand, showing that the mortar was not properly mixed. That mortar, (pointing to specimen,) was good, it came out of the cement mortar, but there was a lack of mixing in those sand pockets very considerably. Q. Well, if that mortar had been good, Mr. Boynton, at the time you saw it in the winter, ought the wall to improve from that time to this? A. Yes, sir, become as hard as that mortar, (pointing to specimen) within the time, to a reasonable distance from the outside, and since I came to-day, some I have seen as hard as that. Q. I understood you, when you were here before, that you were superintending the erection of a large building in Chicago, the walls of which had been exposed. I will ask what building that was? Q. State what effect the winter had on those walls-whether they presented the same appearance that these walls do now? A. I have no information whether they have dried. Q. That is a large building, is it? How thick are the walls? A. Two feet four inches. Mr. ROBINSON, Commissioner: Q. How long have you known Mr. Starck? A. Two years. Q. What was he doing? A. He was in Springfield. Q. Has he any work about Chicago? A. Don't think he has. Q. You regard him as a good architect? A. As far as I saw. Q. How much opportunity have you had to judge of his capacity as an architect? A. From inquiries that I have made. Q. Who did you inquire of? A. Mr. Piquenard says he is a good architect. Q. Does he tell you so? A. Yes, sir. He has worked for Mr. Piquenard. Of course he hasn't worked for me, and I havn't examined any building he has constructed. Q. Do you know Mr. Sloan's character as a builder? A. First class. Q. A man of ability in his profession? A. Yes, sir. Q. Your statement is that some of this work over here is very good, and some very unfair. How is the work, Mr. Boynton, in the cellar or basement part? A. The sub-cellar, I should think, is good work. Q. A portion of the walls are good; did you examine the walls in the west side-the main corridor where there is a large hole cut through the wall? A. That on the west side, some of it, is better, but it isn't good work. Q. Do you say good or bad work? A. Better than some. Q. Good or bad, fair or how is it? I don't ask how it is as compared with the other. A. I have seen fairer work and have seen worsebetter there. a great deal Q. How long have you been an architect-worked at the busi- i ness? A. I have been an architect some thirty-five years. Q. How long have you lived in Chicago? A. Eighteen years. Q. Did you make a plan for this house-I don't remember for this State House? A. No, sir. Q. You made a plan for the Iowa State Piquenard & Cochrane made à plan also. adopted? A. Mine received the premium. Q. Whose plan was adopted? House, for which A. The last time I saw, the Governor hadn't adopted any plan. Q. Yours received the premium? A. Yes, sir. Q. You and they had been competing? A. There yes, sir. Q. What was it worth to do a job of brick work such as the best of that there? A. Do you mean simply the work, or the material too? A. Well, I should judge that such work as that could have been laid last year, including the brick work and mortar, according to the specifications, and according to the standard of the best walls, for from twelve to thirteen dollars. I think I could have contracted for that. By Mr. MUMILLAN : Q. You mean by the thousand? A. Yes, sir. By Mr. ROBERTS: Q. That means measured in the wall? A. Yes, in the wall. By Mr. ROBINSON: That's all. By Mr. ROBERTS: Q. You say the work is defective as to specifications? A. Yes, sir, considering the specifications. Q. Were you the architect on the penitentiary? A. Yes, sir. Q. Did you establish and make out the specifications, and measurements on that work which the State paid for? A. I did. Vol. I-106 M. W. CARTER, sworn, and examined by Mr. ROBERTS, as fol lows: Q. What is your name. A. M. W. Carter. Q. Where do you reside? A. In Chicago. Q. What is your business? A. I am a builder and contractor. Q. How long have you been engaged in that business? A. I have been engaged in the business for twenty-two or twenty-three years, sir. Q. How long have you lived in Chicago? A. About fifteen years. Q. State whether or not you have examined the work upon the new State House. A. Yes, sir; I have this day. Q. State what the result of that examination has been. If you have examined the brick work, please state what the result of your examination has been. A. Yes, sir; I examined the brick work more particularly than anything else. There is some very excellent brick work there, and some very poor. A. The difference between the good and the bad is owing to the mortar-the defect is in the mortar. Q. What is the reason of the defect in the mortar? A. That might be difficult to tell, taking it as it is now. It is plain to be seen it is not right. Why it is not right is that the proper ingredients were not put together to make good mortar. Q. Did you examine any of the lime and sand being used. A. I saw some piles of sand there; I saw some river sand; looked to be river sand; the sand seemed to be pretty good quality; not entirely free from dirt; I saw a pile of yellow sand lying there that had a pretty large proportion of loam in it. Q. Could good mortar be made from that kind of sand, in your judgment? A. It could not be made as good, certainly, out of yellow loam sand. Q. Do you know whether the mortar in those walls was made of that yellow loam sand? Do you know whether that kind of sand was used there in making mortar? A. No, sir; I can not tell after it is made. There are evidences there of improperly slackened lime in the mortar. There are pieces of white lime, about the size of a pea, in some portions of the wall which should not be there, and which does not occur in good mortar. In good mortar the lime and sand is so amalgamated that it is one body-one thing after being mixed. There are no different colors in it, or spots, or anything of the kind to it. Q. Do you know anything about the kind of lime that was used there? A. No, sir. Q. Did you hear any of the contractors or architects say anything about what kind of lime was used? BY MR. ROBINSON: It is Lemont lime. Q. Do you know anything about the Lemont lime? A. Very little. We don't see any of it in Chicago. Our firm never use it. I don't know anything about the lime. Q. Do you know anything about the reputation of the Lemont lime? State what proportion of those walls, in your judgment, are good and what proportion are bad. A. I could not tell you. I didn't examine it far enough to tell. Perhaps it would be rather difficult to tell where the dividing line was. I may be mistaken as regards the points of the compass, but I think it is upon the east side of the building that the walls are good. The walls upon that side as a general thing appear to be good. Some of them are well hardened up for the time they have been laid. Q. What was the defect in the walls that are defective, and will they ever make walls? A. As I said before, the defect is in the mortar. In my opinion, it never will be a good wall. Q. Should any of the walls be taken down? A. I should pronounce them wholly unfit for a building of that kind. Q. About what proportion of the walls are unfit for a building of that kind? A. I am not prepared to say. |