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is to establish justice; that whether there. The expense incurred there for Christians or Druses, justice may be ada police and gaols, was 36,0001. per annum, ministered without partiality, or predilec- whilst the rest of the expenditure was tion, or interference with the Turkish Go- only 70,0001. ; tbus one-third of the whole vernment. I hope we shall never do that expenditure of the Colony was entirely which will not be justifiable towards an taken up by the police and the gaols. It independent State, as it is our object to ob- was proposed by this Bill to retransfer to

, tain the improvement of the condition of his country the proceeds of land sales, the people with as little interference as which had dwindled down to almost nopossible with the sovereign rights of an in-thing; to take into the hands of the Godependent State-a State which, however vernment the proceeds of the sales of imperfect may be its government and its lands, after they had been improved by condition in many respects, we have an in-convict labour, and to release the Colony terest in preserving and strengthening by from the gaol and police expenses. It was all the means in our power. As there is no

proposed to allow the best-conducted conobjection to produce the Papers, I do not victs to become renters of Government see that it is necessary for me to trouble land in Van Diemen's Land: whereas in your Lordships any further.

New South Wales, the object was to give Lord Beaumont said, he wished the

a certain noble Earl had read the debate in the ble the free occupier to surround himself

of tenure, and ena

permanency French Chamber, because he would have with some of the comforts of life. He seen thal M. Guizot did not abandon the (Lord Stanley) believed the Bill would be principle of acting alone, and was pre- found satisfactory to many of those who pared to act in favour of the Maronites; had presented petitions to Parliament. and that there was a difference of opinion

The Marquess of Lansdowne was not between England and France, not as to prepared to oppose the Bill in its present the object, but as to the remedy. He was, stage. He thought a case might be made however, glad he had given the noble out for legislative interference. But when Earl an opportunity of making the state- entering upon so large a subject, he conment which their Lurdships had heard. sidered it was absolutely necessary that Motion agreed to.

the noble Lord should make out a case of

most urgent necessity before their LordWaste Lands (AUSTRALIA) Bill.] ships consented to pass a Bill of this Lord Stanley moved the Second Reading of nature, especially as they were now the Waste Lands (Australia) Bill, in doing coming to the close of the Session, and which the noble Lord explained the state when many important measures, which of the law as it stood at present in the had undergone great consideration, had Australian Colonies with reference to waste already been deferred to another period. lands. One object of the Bill was to au- Many of the clauses of this Bill might be thorize the Governor of New South Wales of value, and among the rest, he thought to grant leases of waste lands within or the system of granting licenses for the ocwithout the limits of the Colony,on the same cupation of waste lands might be attended terms as the other lands were disposed of, with beneficial effects; but there were namely, by auction. It was proposed, provisions in the Bill, giving to the Goverhowever, to restrict the leases to lwenty- nor such arbitrary powers, that he was one years at the outside. The produce of entirely opposed to them. By the 6th the revenue to be derived under the Bill Clause, persons who had already occupied was to be applied in part to raise a fund parts of the waste lands under licenses, for the encouragement of immigration of were to be made liable, at the pleasure of free labourers;—but this regarded New the Governor, to an amount of taxation South Wales only. In Australia there almost indefinite, assuming the sinape of an was no want of capital, but there was a agistment tax. It authorized a tax upon deficiency of labour. In Van Diemen's cattle, paying a certain sum per year for Land, on the other hand, there was a every horse, sheep, and head of horned superabundance of labour seeking for em- cattle depastured upon the waste lands ployment. This, resulted, in great part, which Her Majesty's Privy Council or the from the excess of convict labour. We, Governor might decide upon. To this he moreover, imposed a heavy tax upon the most strongly objected. Their Lordships Colony on account of the convicts we sent were aware of the effect of a law of agist


pasture stock.

year to

ment in Ireland ; and he thought it would was clearly impossible, at this period of be a rash, inconsiderate, and ill-judged the Session, the measure could be well measure to introduce into Australia. He considered; and it was more than probawished to impress it upon their Lordships, ble that, if considered, it would not be sathat they were now, in fact, laying the tisfactory. foundation of a principle of property which Lord Polwarth expressed a hope that would affect iwo thousand miles of terri- the provision which made some amends to tory and vast millions of acres of land, and Van Diemen's Land for the expense inthat without giving the measure such con- curred by gaols and police might also be sideration as its importance demanded, extended to Australia. and which if brought on early in the next Bill read 2a. Session it would of course obtain.

Lord Stanley observed, that the noble Marquess seemed to suppose that the

Foreign Lotteries Bill.] Moved

that the Bill be now read 3a. license conferred a permanent right upon

But that was not the party obtaining it.

Lord Monteagle said, he wished to have

a clause inserted which should provide the case. It was an annual license to

for and insist upon the enforcement of the

law with regard to the publication of noThe Marquess of Lansdowne: Was it not a license to occupy?

tices in newspapers relative to foreign loi

teries. As all newspapers and periodicals Lord Stanley: No; it was merely a license to depasture stock within a certain sioners of Stamps and Taxes, he was of

came under the inspection of the Commisdistrict. The Governor was at the present opinion that that body should be entrusted

. moment perfectly free to fix from

with the enforcement of the law in this year the amount to be paid by each party obtaining a license.

respect, and he should propose the inserLord Monteagle objected to the 6th tion of some such clause as the following: and 13th Clauses, which he believed bad • Be it enacted, that whenever it shall excited the greatest possible apprehension appear to the Commissioners of Stamps and and alarm. He objected to their provi. Taxes, from the inspection of newspapers and sions as perfecily without precedent. In periodicals, that there has been inserted any

advertisement or notice of foreign lotteries, 1842, an Act was passed regulating the they shall take the necessary proceedings to sale of Colonial property; but the pro-enforce the law." posed Bill, which extended to the whole of the Australian Colonies, suspended the Though he wished, however, to have a operation of the existing Statute law of the clause inserted, he should be satisfied if the land so long as any Colony should conti- noble Lord would give him an assurance nue to be a place to which felons might that the law was to be enforced, and that be conveyed for punishment. The noble these great frauds and nuisances should Lord stated that he meant it to apply only


put down by the strong hand of the

law, to Van Diemen's Land; but an Order in Council, by sending even as sew as ten

Lord Stanley assured the noble Lord felons to New Zealand, or any other Co that it was not intended that the law

should become a dead letter in this respect. lony, would extend the provisions at once

He did not think it would be necessary to to those places.

Lord Stanley explained, that the Bill introduce a clause; but he would take could not apply to any existing Colonies,

care that such instructions should be given

as should secure the enforcement of the as their charters would not permit the sending of felons there; but if new Co. Ilaw to its fullest extent.

Bill read 3a. Jonies should be established, and it should be deemed necessary to found new penal settlements in sucn places, but for the Field GARDENS' Bul.] The Duke of provision referred to, those Colonies would Richmond moved the Second Reading of be subject to the old Land Sales Act. this Biil.

Lord Monteagle, in continuation, ex- The Earl of Radnor objected to the pressed his regret that the Bill had been Bill, both in principle and detail. He introduced at so late a period of the Ses wished to know whether the Government sion, not only on public grounds, but also approved or not of such a measure, as in for the sake of the noble Lord himself. It the former case it ought to be left to the




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of Estates.

hands of some noble Lord on the Treasury 9. Because if I am mistaken in this characBench, or not brought forward at all. ter of the people, and their comparative

Lord Stanley defended the Bill both in worth, the evil ought to be cured by good its principle, and against the objections example and education ; and will only be agurged by the noble Earl. The noble Lord gravated by such measures as those contem. said that the noble Earl might judge from

plated by the present Bill.

Radnor. what he had said, whether he and his (Lord Stanley's) Colleagues in office, did or did not approve of the Bill.

II OUSE OF COMMONS, Bill was then read a second time.

Friday, July 18, 1845. House adjourned.

Minutes.] Bills. Public.-10. Libel; Removal of PauThe following Protest against the Second

pers; Customs Laws Repeal; Customs Management;

Customs Duties; Warehousing of Goods; British VesReading of the Field Gardens Bill was

sels; Shipping and Navigation; Trade of British Posses. entered on the Journals :

sions Abroad; Customs Bounties and Allowances ; Isle of 1. Because by this Bill there may be estab

Man Trade ; Sinuggling Prevention ; Customs Regula.

tion; Testamentary Dispositions, &c.; Joint Stock lished in every parish in the kingdom a Board Banks (Scotland and Ireland); Compensations; Drainage endowed with corporate privileges, irresponsible, and armed with powers which may be

20. Small Debts (No. 3); Slave Trade (Brazil); Muni. used for purposes of favouritism on the one

cipal Districts, &c. (Ireland); Stamp Duties, &c.; Mi

litia Pay; Railways (Selling or Leasing). hand, or of oppression on the other.

Reported.-Lunatics : Grand Jury Presentments (Dublin); 2. Because the objects of this Bill, purport- Drainage of Lands; Jurors Books (Ireland); Poor Law ing to be subsidiary to the provisions for the Amendment (Scotland); Small Debts (No. 5); Jewish relief of the poor, under divers Acts of Par- Disabilities Removal : Bonded Corn; Excise Duties on liament, are, in truth, in direct contravention

Spirits (Channel Islands); Masters and Workmen; Fish

eries (Ireland). to their principle.

3o. and passed :-— Ecclesiastical Patronage (Ireland); Joint 3. Because, as in each parisli, where the

Stock Companies; Land Revenue Act Amendment; provisions of this Bill shall be adopted, the Drainage (Ireland); Merchant Seamen; Spirits (Ire. field-wardens will be wholly unconnected with land). those of every other, and uncontrolled by any

Private.--1°. Molyneux's (Follett's) Estate ; Duke of

Bridgewater's Estate ; Winchester College Estate. superior power, it cannot be doubted that in

20. North Walsham School Estate. process of time there will be introduced in

Reported.---Bolton and Leigh, Kenyon and Leigh Junction, different parishes a diversity of practice, which Liverpool and Manchester, and Grand Junction Railway will lead to heart-burnings, discontent, and Companies Amalgamation ; South Eastern Railway confusion.

(Branch to Deal, and Extension of the South Eastern, 4. Because the provisions of this Bill, if

Canterbury, Ramsgate and Margate Railway): Darby

Court (Westminster). carried out in the fairest and most equitable

3o. and passed :-Dublin Pipe Water (No.2); South manner, will necessarily aggravate the ac- Eastern Railway (Widening and Extension of the London knowledged evils resulting from the present and Greenwich Railway); Rothwell Prison. law of settlement.

PetitionS PRESENTED. By several hon. Members, from a 5. Because its unavoidable tendency is to

great number of places, in favour of the 'en Hours

System in Factories. From Kingston-upon-Hull, against promote early and improvident marriages, and

Lunatic Asylums and Pauper Lunatics Bill.-By Lord to give an unnatural stimulus to the increase of

Ashley, from Pershore, for Diminishing the Number of population, already superabundant in the Public Houses.-By Mr. Hawes, from Starch Makers of agricultural districts.

London, against Smoke Prohibition Bill. - By Lord 6. Because the necessary consequence will

Ashley, from Charles Whitlaw, for Inquiry into his

Case. be the lowering of the wages of the agricultural labourer.

The House met at twelve o'clock. 7. Because the provisions of this Bill lead to the indefinite increase of holdings and di- VALUATION (Ireland).] House in visions of land, and thus to many of the evils Committee on the Valuation (Ireland) which now press so severely on the people of Bill. Ireland.

On Clause 5, 8. Because they are in accordance with an opinion much in vogue, but which I think false Viscount Clements objected to the in itself, and injurious to the people ; founded whole Bill. It was preposterous to in. on an unfair estimate of their intelligence and troduce a measure of this importance at spirit, and (if acted upon) tending to lower

so late a period of the Session, and to try their independence, and to degrade their mo- to carry it on in a House consisting of ral condition, viz., that they cannot manage

four Irish Members, and eleven Members their own concerns, but must be cared for overlooked,

from other parts of the three kingdoms. and directed by others, their superiors perhaps in fortune, but I believe by He would not be a party to such a course; no means superior to them in virtue, natural and he would now move that the House intelligence, or public spirit.

be counted.

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The Chairman counted the Committee; / sense of the House taken on it, in a much and there being only twelve Members fuller attendance of Members. present, left the Chair; and Mr. Speaker

Mr. George Hamilton said, that his baving resumed it,

hon. Friend the Member for Londonderry The Chairman reported to him that knew very well--no one better-how genthere were not forty Members present. eral was the complaint in Ireland with

The House was again counted, and regard to the want of uniformity and acforty Members being present, again re- curacy of all existing valuations. Nosolved itself into a Committee on the thing could be more desirable than one above Bill.

uniform and accurate valuation on a pro. On the Question, “ that Clause 5 stand per principle, which would be understood. part of the Bill.”

The principle of the valuation proposed Viscount Clements said, he would die in the Bill, was what he considered the vide the Commiltee.

only sound principle, namely, the letting Strangers were excluded, but no di- value, to a solvent tenant. Certainly it vision took place, Viscount Clements find I would have been better if the Bill bad

been introduced at an earlier period ; but iny no seconder.

the effect of the postponement would be On the Question being again put, the delay of a year in commencing the

Viscount Clements said, he would move valuation on sound principles. "that the further progress of the Bill be Clauses to the 18th agreed to. postponed for six months."

On Clause 15, “ Decision of Sub-comSir T. Fremantle urged on the noble

missioners to be conclusive.” Lord the necessiiy of allowing the Bill 10

Mr. Sherman Crawfordobjected strongly proceed.

to ibis clause. Sir R. Ferguson would again press on

Viscount Clements concurred in the the right hon. Baronet what he had often urged before--namely, to try the Bill as an be taught to look to their natural guides,

objection. The people of Ireland should experiment in those counties which had

the magistracy and geniry, and not to not yet been valued. Viscount Clements had no wish to let

Government officers. others do for him what he could do for

Sir R. Ferguson was of opinion, that himself; and he therefore objected to this in reference to the valuation of tenements, Bill, on the ground that it committed to it would be desirable to do away with the the Executive Government in Ireland, appeal, where the Sub-commissioners difwhat could be more satisfactorily done by fer, to the Committee of Appeal, and 10 the grand juries of counties, as far as re

give it to the quarter sessions. lated to valuation, and applotting the

Mr. George Hamilton concurred, on grand jury cess. Under these circum- the whole, with the suggestions of his stances, he would persevere in his oppo-hon. Friends; there was, in Ireland a sition to the Bill.

natural and not an unjust jealousy of Mr. S. Crawford also urged on the Government Commissioners, especially right hon. Baronet the propriety of adopt- where there was no appeal from them. ing the suggestions of the hon. Baronet He thought the best machinery would be (Sir R. Ferguson), of letting the measure an appeal from the valuator of tenements stand as an experiment on those counties to the Sub-commissioners, as the Bill prowhich had not been valued.

vided, that is, if the owner of a tenement Sir T. Fremantle said, he could not should not be satisfied with the valuation take upon himself to follow the advice of of it; the Sub-commissioners should exthe hon. Baronet, without more consider-amine and correct the valuation. He ation; and, therefore, if the noble Lord would add to that, an appeal 10 the Barwould allow the remaining clauses to go rister at quarter sessions. Generally, he through Committee, he would—if no ob- supposed, the revision of the Sub-comiection existed in other quarters-comply missioners would be satisfactory, and not with the suggestion; bui if he could not the less likely to be so, if there was an consent to the suggestion, he would pro

appeal from it. mise the noble Lord and the hon. Baro- The remaining clauses were agreed to. net, an ample opportunity of discussing

House resumed. Bill to be reported. the point at another stage, and have the At the five o'clock sittings,

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SMALL Debts (No. 3) BILL.] The | The deposition in respect to the latter priSolicitor General said as this was a Bill of soners, which had been laid before another the utmost importance to the mercantile magistrate, stated that they were two classes, it would be necessary to have it young girls-one only eleven years of age, passed through the House with the least and the other fourteen. The first was appossible delay. He had had several comprehended by a constable on the charge munications with hon. Members on both of stealing a ballpenny worth of coals, and sides of the House who were connected with the latter for stealing a waistcoat of little the mercantile interest, and they had ex. value. The deponent, who was sister to pressed their approval of the measure. one of these unfortunate girls, stated that He proposed, then, with the leave of the she went to the constable, on the evening House, that the Bill should be read a of her committal, who had Eliza Price in second time, and that they should after- custody, when she found her sister in a wards go pro formd into Committee this back kitchen; that she asked him whether evening, for the purpose of making certain she could have a bed, when he replied in alterations and adding some clauses to the the negative, as he had not one there ; Bill which were deemed necessary to ren. that she then offered money to procure her der it completely satisfactory. The Bill, sister a bed, which was also refused. On with the amendments, could then be printed, the following morning she again called, and delivered into the hands of Members when she found her sister with handcuffs to-morrow or Monday.

upon her, and chained to the grate. On Bill read a second time.

the next morning she called and found On the Motion for going into Committee her sister in the same dreadful condition, pro forma,

and the other prisoner, Emma Woodall

, Mr. Wakley suggested to the hon, and also chained in like manner to the grate. learned Gentleman the propriety of at Her sister said that she had never been once stating those amendments he intended washed since she was taken into custody, to propose. The Bill, as it then stood, he and asked deponent for some soap. This thought was a satisfactory measure to the statement was corroborated by another sisa public generally, and was decidedly an ter of the deponent. It appeared that

, improvement on that of last year. He Mr. Briscoe, before whom these two young should, therefore, like to know at once the girls were brought, had desired the concharacter of the changes that were to be stable to take them to bis house, where made in it.

they were confined for four days, and were Sir J. Graham thought that the course bouh chained to the grate in the back which his hon. and learned Friend pro-, kitchen. He (Mr. Duncombe) observed posed to take was decidedly the most con- that this appeared to be a most monstrous venient one, and to which no reasonable case of cruelty, and that the constable, if objection could be well urged.

found guilty of baving acted so to these Bill committed pro formá, and ordered young women, should be made an example to be recommitted.

of, and the most effectual means taken 10

put an end to such a system that was PUNISHMENT Staffordshire.] alleged to prevail in the neighbourhood of Mr. T. Duncombe wished to ask the right | Mr. Briscoe's magisterial authority. hon. Baronet whether he was prepared Sir J. Graham said, he should not have to lay on the Table of the House the the least objection to produce the minutes Report of Mr. Robins, relative to the sys- of evidence which had been taken before tem pursued by a magistrate and certain the Commissioner in respect to the cases consiables in Staffordshire in respect to referred to, and the report of the Commisthe punishment of Eliza Price; and also sioner himself upon such evidence. He whether, in addition 10 such report, he would be also happy to lay upon the Table would also produce a copy of the corre- of the House a copy of the letter which he spondence between the Government and had addressed to the Lord Lintenant of the Lord Lieutenant of Staffordshire upon Staffordshire on the subject, enclosing the the subject? He had recently received a Report of the Commissioner and the micommunication from the same neighbour-nutes of evidence. The hon. Member for hood, where it appeared that the same kind Finsbury would then see that he had of treatment had been pursued against two pointed ihe attention of the Lord Lieutenwomen under the warrant of a Mr. Briscoe. Want to this practice of chaining prisoners


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