such bills in the Senate; but I Mr. HENDERSON. In the old ents in order to secure the passage of object to their originating in both Constitution we had a provision which such appropriation bills as the necesHouses at the same time. I do not has been read here, that bills might sities of the case seemed to require. I like very well to talk about my own originate in either House. The ques-can see no objection to allowing the experiences, but I have seen how this tion has never been raised that the committee of ways and means of the matter works. I know this much: that House in which the bills did not origin- House, and the committee of finance when a committee who have charge of ate had not a perfect right to make in the Senate, to confer together when such a bill come to the conclusion that amendments to those bills; nor would the Legislature has nearly completed they will appropriate a certain amount the question arise here. its session, and to report such approof money in the one House, a similar Mr. BLACKMAN. The gentleman priation bills as may be necessary after committee is considering the same bill does not evidently understand the the limitation has expired. in the other House, and they also rec-point I make. The point was that ommend the appropriation of a cer- under a Constitution which did not tain amount of money. It seems to provide that a particular class of bills me that some mode should be devised should originate only in one House, to provide for these matters being con- either House had the right to make sidered in some other way, so that but amendments. But it is proposed here one appropriation for one object will to make a provision restricting the be recommended, and that we shall be origination of certain bills to one able to get along much more satisfac- House. torily to all concerned than we now do. Mr. M. C. WATKINS. I cannot At present, appliances are used to secure see any appropriateness in the amend- the PRESIDENT having resumed the appropriations for one object; after ment offered by the gentleman from our sympathies have been wrought up Macomb, (Mr. MUSSEY.) His idea Mr. PRINGLE reported that the in that direction, appliances are seems to be that, in the first place, the committee of the whole, pursuant to brought to bear to secure appropria- sums should be fixed upon which the the order of the Convention, had had tions for another object, and our sym- Legislature may deem it necessary or under consideration the article entitled pathies are turned in another direc- proper to appropriate, and then that "Legislative Department," had made tion, and thus we may find at last, that sum should be divided up among the some progress therein, and had direcwe have appropriated four hundred several different objects for which ap- ted him to ask leave for the committee thousand dollars, when we should have propriations should be made. I do not to sit again. appropriated only three hundred thou- understand that this has been the sand dollars. I would have the bills course of former Legislatures, and I for this purpose originate in the House | doubt very much whether it would be The motion was agreed to, upon a division; ayes 32, nões 27. The committee accordingly rose; and Leave was accordingly granted. The motion was agreed to; and ac-year 1835, to and ineluding the year 1867, I hearing him lecture on this interesting cordingly (at five minutes past 5 o'clock have the honor to submit the following state-subject in this Hall on Monday evening p. m.,) the Convention adjourned. FORTIETH DAY. SATURDAY, July 13, 1867. Prayer by Rev. Mr. SPENCER. ment. Very respectfully. J. EUGENE TENNEY, The communication with the accom- The statement was as follows: Year. The roll was called and a quorum an- 1838, Annual swered to their names. 57 next. The resolution was adopted. LEGISLATIVE DEPARTMENT. Convention resolve itself into commit- The Convention accordingly resolved 12 itself into committee of the whole, (Mr. 15 PRINGLE in the chair,) and resumed the consideration of the article entitled 103 "Legislative Department." Commencem❜t End'g No. days. 52 96 86 The CHAIRMAN. When the committee rose yesterday, it had proceeded 72 in the consideration of this article as 100 far as section seventeen, which had been amended to read as follows: 70 1835, Regular session,. 1839, April 20, .Jan. 6, April 1, 1841, tr .Jan. 4, April 13, 1842, ''' Feb. 17, **99 1843, ...Jan. 2, March 9, 66 72 92 1850, " ......Jan. 7, April 2, 85 ..Feb. 1, April 5, of 1853, Biennial ..Jan. 5, Feb. 14, 40 40 Jan. 7, Feb. 16, 40 ......Jan. 20, Feb. 4, 15 แ ......Jan. 5, Feb. 15, 40 ................Jan. 2, March 16, 73 .May 7, May 11, 4 1857, Biennial 1858 Extra 1862, Extra 1864, Extra 1865, Regular 66 "Bills may originate in either House of the Legislature; but no new bill, except appropriation bills, shall be introduced after the first forty days of a session shall have expired.' No further amendment was offered to this section. VETO POWER OF THE GOVERNOR. PRINTING ARTICLES ORDERED TO A THIRD to the Governor before it becomes a law. It READING. he approve he shall sign it; but if not he shall return it with his objections, to the Mr. FARMER. I offer the following House in which it originated, which shall resolution: Resolved, That all articles which have been ordered to a third reading be printed in bill enter the objections at large upon the journal, and reconsider it. On such reconsideration, if two-thirds of the members elected Mr. INGALLS presented the petition of Mathew H. Maynard, H. D. Smith and Jas. M. Wilkinson, for appointment of judges of supreme and circuit courts by the Governor and agree to pass the bill, it shall be sent with the objections to the other House, by which it Senate; which was referred to the committee on the judicial department. thirds of the members elected to that House, shall be reconsidered. If approved by twoMr. PRATT presented the petition for the information of members. The it shall become a law. In such case the vote of Wm. R. Montgomery and others, third reading have been printed in the voting for and against the bill shall be enarticles which have been ordered to a of both Houses shall be determined by yeas and nays; and the names of the members supervisors of Hillsdale county, praying that fines incurred may be credited journal, but not in such a form that tered on the journals of each House respectto the poor fund; which was referred they can be readily examined by mem-ively. If any bill be not returned by the Govto the committee on finance and tax-bers. If they are printed in bill form ation and education, jointly. ernor within ten days, Sundays excepted, after it has been presented to him, the same shall become a law in like manner as if he had signed it, unless the Legislature, by their adjournment, prevent its return; in which case it shall not become a law. The Governor the Secretary of State, within five days after may approve, sign, and file in the office of the adjournment of the Legislature, any act passed during the last five days of the session, and the same shall become a law. lution will pass, as has been stated by Mrs. David Thompson, Henry Blackman, David L. Pratt, jr., and 122 other the mover, (Mr. FARMER,) for the incitizens, men and women of Hillsdale formation of members. As they are county, in favor of prohibiting the printed now, I confess that I have been Mr. BURTCH. I move to amend granting of license for the sale of in- unable to keep the run of the multi- this section by striking out the word toxicating liquors as a beverage. farious amendments which have been "two-thirds," in the third sentence of made to them. I should be very glad the section, and inserting in its place to see our work put in such a shape the words, "a majority," so that that that I can understand it. that I can understand it. sentence will read, "on such reconsideration, if a majority of the members elected agree to pass the bill," etc. I have ward, and no axes to grind in this matno enemies to punish, or friends to reter. If I should have no apprehension for the present generation, in allowing this section to pass as reported by the committee, I should have fearful apProfessor Perrine is known through-prehensions for future generations. In out our State as a man of large exper- this country the political horizon seems ience, of sound intellect, and as an able to be troubled. There are clouds here by the Constitutional Convention on yester- lecturer. I hope that the members of and there, and a hurricane sometimes day, asking information in regard to the length of the various sessions of the Mich- this Convention, and the citizens of arises from a very small cloud. Now, igan Legislature, from and including the Lansing, may have an opportunity of sir, this rule of two-thirds contravenes every principle of republicanism, and every principle of democracy. I claim to be more of a Republican than are Republicans, and more of a Democrat than are Democrats. The Republicans have pretty generally responded to this idea, that two-thirds should be required under peculiar circumstances to pass a law; so it has been with the Democrats. Now, just. so far as we go beyond the majority, just so far do we go for the one man rule, and the one man idea of government. the whole land. revolution more direful in its conse- but the duty, of every man to labor educated through cunning and craft The public good is of the first importance. After you have secured the rights of persons and of property, so far as they should be secured in the fundamental law, the public welfare to come. should be paramount. We have seen in the storm that has just passed over us, these clouds growing darker, until alarm and consternation overshadowed And these fearful apprehensions have not been without effect in the Congress of the United States. Under the pressure of the times, men have been driven out of the Congress of the nation, for the purpose Mr. VAN VALKENBURGH. I of securing for one side a two-thirds would inquire of the Chair what is the majority, perhaps, when there would question before the committee? have been no cause of alarm provi- The CHAIRMAN. The question is ded there had been no veto power upon the amendment of the gentleman in connection with the national govern- from Eaton, (Mr. BURTCH,) to strike ment. In that case a majority could out the word "two-thirds," and insert have controlled without any difficulty. the words "a majority." Now, a political faction may take pos- Mr. BURTCH. Then would come session of the executive of the nation, what? If political action should fail and through its influence, that politi- to produce the results desired, then cal faction may control the power of what would come? Sir, it would be a the government, to the disparagement war; a war between the masses and of the best interests of the people. . The CHAIRMAN. Will the gentleman from Eaton so direct his remarks that the committee may see their application to the question? The Chair is not able to see it. Mr. BURTCH. Perhaps the Chair is not able. to see it, or the committee more en either. Some have ears to hear and The CHAIRMAN. The remark of the Chair was directed, not to the character of the remarks of the gentleman, but to their applicability to the question before the committee. The question before the committee is upon a certain amendment. Mr. BURTCH. Exactly! and what is that amendment? It is that one man shall not have the power to control the majority of the Legislature. the classes. And whether it be repub- I understand the thing, I think. I The veto power has crippled the en- lican or whether it be democratic, it think that gentlemen, if they will look ergies of the State of Michigan, when matters not. We find this to be true to this matter, will see that the drift of it was exercised in Congress, against all the world over, that governments my argument is, that one man shall I the appropriations to be made and ex- are universally in the hands of the not take control of many men. pended in Michigan; and by means of classes, and out of the possession of say that when a majority have secured a faction, those appropriations were the masses. Now, sir, what will we the personal rights of men and their used in the South, for the benefit of find under the circumstances? We will rights of property, as they should be the South, and for the disparagement find that one of these parties being in secured in the fundamental law of any of the North. The same thing may power, being in possession of the gov-State, then it should be left to majoriapply to State government as well. ernment, being in possession of all the ties to control so far as the interests of But not only that; I see all around me, fortifications, of the army, of the navy, the State are concerned. What would that there is a strong tendency to class. being in possession of the sword, and you think of a school district where When I use the term "class," I speak the treasury of the government, there one-third would get control of twoof those men who have never labored will be a terrible war. It will be just thirds? What would you think of or toiled, except by the brain in work-like all other wars, except the last one, such powers in a school district? How ing out means to rob the masses; we a war against tyranny and oppression. | far advanced would the educational inhave seen a little of it in this govern- The last war we had was a war for the terests of the State of Michigan be, if ment, when under the pretence, that it purpose of oppression, unlike anything that rule was in operation in our school was necessary for certain purposes, the heard of before in the history of the districts? I apprehend they would be riches of the classes of this country world. as far in the back-ground as many of have been exempted from taxes upon Now, sir, I hope that when we go those eastern cities which have been their capital, both in the State and in away from this hall we shall have quoted here as good authority in conthe nation. If this was the only in- adopted a system that will be adapted stitutional law. Rhode Island has stance that would occur, perhaps we to the true interests of the people; one been quoted here as good authority, might survive. But if these things are that will secure them against faction, yet that State neglected to adopt reto be constantly on the increase, and a bribery, and corruption; one that will publican principles in her institutions, distinction is to be drawn between the be an honor to the virtue and intelli- but kept the charter it received from moneyed institutions of the country gence of the great State of Michigan. King James until a revolution broke and the masses, I see before us a It is the right, and not only the right out in the State. That may be good in authority for some gentlemen, but such in the same manner. Under the rule bill over the Governor's veto. The authority as that is no authority for me. as laid down in this section, there will amendment of the gentleman from I say that all that is necessary here be required sixty-seven members of the Clinton, (Mr. DANIELLS,) as stated by regard to this veto power is, that House of Representatives to pass the the gentleman from Macomb, (Mr. after a veto message has been spread bill over the Governor's veto. If my MUSSEY,) would not require that numupon the journal, and presented to the amendment is adopted, a bill can be so ber; it would leave it so that a much understanding of the members of the passed by two-thirds of the members less number than a majority of the Legislature, then the majority of that present, which is the rule, I think, in members elected could pass a bill over Legislature should control. Sir, is the the State of New York, and also in the the Governor's veto. Mr. GIDDINGS. I do not propose knowledge of one man superior to the Congress of the United States. knowledge of fifty men? Because a Mr. MUSSEY. I cannot very well to make any argument on this quesman has been elected Governor, is sit quiet, if there is any probability tion. But there arises a difficulty in there any more concentrated wisdom that that amendment will pass? It my mind about passing this section in him than there was before he was will take but a moment's reflection to just as it stands. I suppose the House elected Governor? Not a bit of it. see that it will require a less number of Representatives is generally like He might improve a little if he of votes to pass a bill over a veto than this body, without a full number of looked around him, and he might not; it would require to pass the bill in the members being present; seldom will he might go the other way; he might first place. Suppose the House of there be more than eighty members fall back. Suffice it to say, that I ap- Representatives was as full as the Con- present. In order to pass a bill over prehend you will find in Congress, men vention is to-day. It would take fifty- the Governor's veto, according to this who, it will be acknowledged, at least by one votes to pass a bill before it could section as it now stands, it would take my Republican friends, to be equal in go to the Governor at all. Then when almost that number of votes. It strikes capacity to the President; yet the it came back with his veto, if there me that members here must see that it President can thwart the will of a were but a quorum of members pres- is worthy of consideration at least, majority of the members in either ent, or if there were sixty-one mem- whether the number required to pass a House. I apprehend that after you bers, as we have here to-day, forty-two bill over the Governor's veto, accordhave elected a Governor in the State votes could pass the bill over his veto ing to this section, that is, two-thirds of Michigan, you then have not se- according to this amendment. Now, of all the members elected, is not too cured all the concentrated wisdom of if the Convention wish to place the Michigan. Now, after the Governor matter in that position, then I think has spread out at large his objections they should go back and strike out the to any bill, the people of the great words, "a majority of members electState of Michigan, convened in the ed," which is the number required to legislative hall, certainly have wisdom pass the bill in the first place. enough to understand whether the best interests of the peoole and of the State of Michigan, would be carried out by passing the bill. States the Governor has no veto at all. Mr. DANIELLS. A majority of the States of the Union do not require two-thirds of the members elected to pass a bill over the Governor's veto. Now, I will refer you to one State in I do not think that more than onethe Union whose Constitution was like third of the States now in the Union, what this would be, provided my require a two-thirds vote to pass a bill amendment is adopted That State over the Governor's veto. In many does not now stand in very good favor; though you know that persons are liable to fall from grace, and so it is with States. I refer you to the State of Kentucky. That had a like Constitution to what this would be, provided that this amendment was made. I think it was a good one. I think it would be surer in many respects to promote the general welfare. Now, with these few remarks, I submit the matter to the consideration of the committee. .. The question was taken upon the amendment of Mr. BURTCH, and it was not agreed to. Mr. DANIELLS. I move to amend the third sentence of this section by striking out, after the word "members," the word "elected," and inserting the word "present." If that large a number. I am not certain but that is best. But I just make the suggestion that the matter is worthy of our consideration, especially when we find that in some States there is no such power granted to the Governor. I think we shonld not pass over this matter hastily or without considerable consideration. Mr. MUSSEY. Are there many States which require only a majority of the number present to pass bills? If so, then there might.be some consistency in requiring only that number to pass them over the Governor's veto. Mr. GIDDINGS. I do not see how that affects this question one way or the other. I suppose the general rule Mr. TURNER. And in Maryland. is to require a law to be passed by the Mr. DANIELLS. I do not know majority; I have never been quite cerbut what it is so in Maryland. The tain about that. Some one suggested veto is generally considered, in the to me yesterday, that while the originpractice of various States in the Union, al law might be passed by a majority an anti-democratic power. If you re- of the members elected, that it would quire two-thirds of the members elected be better not to allow that law to be to pass a bill over the veto of the Gov-amended or changed except by a twoernor, I question if you can ever pass thirds vote. I am not certain that he any law over a Gevernor's veto. Our was not correct. But the question Governor would then have a one man arises whether this section does not repower. If the committee want to quire too great a number to pass the insert that, then they can do so. But bill over the Governor's veto. Ithink they will see the time, or our constituents will, when such a question as this will not pass by unheeded. Mr. BLACKMAN. We just voted Mr. MUSSEY. That is as much as to say that the position I took was inconsistent. I merely asked the Convention to be consistent. If we were amenent is adopted, the sentence down a proposition of the gentleman to strike out the clause requiring a will read, "on such reconsideration, if from Eaton, (Mr. BURTOH,) which did two-thirds of the members present not receive a single vote in its favor. agree to pass the bill, it shall be sent, I think we would have done better to with the objections, to the other House, adopt that than the motion now made, by which it shall be considered." I because it proposed to require a mamove also to amend the next sentence jority of the members elected to pass a majority of the members elected to pass a bill in the first place, then it might be consistent to have but twothirds of those voting to pass a bill over the Governor's veto. If we should decide that, in a House of fifty-one mem |